EXCHANGE OF EMAILS

agrasen

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Re: Exchange of Your email with Shri Aditya Ahuja :

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satish gupta Sat, May 29, 2010 at 11:42 AM
To: rameshjhalla@yahoo.co.uk





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From: satish gupta
To: aditya ahuja
Cc: Rita Virji ; rashtra1947@aol.com; pravakta@hindujagruti.org; proudhindu@yahoogroups.com; aryasamajonline@yahoo.com; vimal ; planvest ; lashkarehind06@yahoo.co.in; Arun Kundra ; girish khosla ; ck ; s bangia ; fast adv ; swatanter ; hrtools ; aryayouth ; dkbhagat
Sent: Sat, 29 May, 2010 7:53:03 PM
Subject: Exchange of Your email with Shri Aditya Ahuja :


Madam Ritaji,

I am a straightforward Born Nationalist , Strongly believing in Hinduism a proud Youngman of 78, who is NEVER- Never Greedy , NOR SELFISH, Free from all the Ps :" Pad , Paisa, Prashansha, Pratishtha etc.", A TOTALLY FEARLESS HINDU, BELIEVING HONESTLY IN THE TEACHINGS OF ARYASAMAJ & MAHARISHI DAYANAND, WHO LIBERATED OUR ENTIRE HINDU SAMAJ FROM ITS SUPERSTITIONS & BLIND FAITHS BESIDES SEVERAL ILLS of our HINDU SOCIETY.

I am NOT knowing Shri Aditya Ahuja personally , rather, in one of the mails, if I remember Correctly, perhaps he had some griviance against me , but I kept my Cool & replied to him in a befitting Humble Polite way as a good Human being should do. To me , shri Aditya Ahuja seems to be an Honest Straight-forward Hindu who will NOT hesitate to say against anything he sees anything wrong anywhere.

You are an young lady from a so called advanced Western Country, adopting its culture, I believe , you may have also acquired its British culture & traditions though I am VERY MUCH AGAINST BRITAIN, known as U.K. or Great Britain, rather I hate British people for their having ruled over India through their deceit , as I treat Britain as one of the Nation of Cowards in the world :

1. Do you know how their Lord Clive had defeated Tipu Sultan ? If not, better undergo further trg. please, madam !

2. Do you know how they succeeded in 1857 ?

3. Are you aware of the History of Partition & why they had selected Mid-night of 15th August , 1947 ? PLEASE SEE VARIOUS DOCUMENTS OF THE GOVT OF INDIA AT "TEEN MURTY " LIBRARY AT NEW DELHI.

( Do U know LAHORE , which had majority of Hindu population, was given away to Pakistan on the evening of 14th August, 1947 by our First Prime Minister, Nehru, thereby millions of our Hindus were killed/butchured, Hindu girls were raped & almost 100% of Hindus were forced to embrace Islam, thus those Hindus who were converted into ISLAM enmasse had retained names like Abdul Karim"Arora", Jamaluddin "Sehgal", Nazam "Sethi" and so on. ): a visit to Lahore should vouch for my above statement please.

4. Are you aware of the battle of Al-Alamin to River Sangro , Who won that war during 2nd World War for them ? It was Indian 4th & 19th Armed Divisions in particular, not the British General Montgomry, madam !.

5. Who fought for them in the Jungles of Burma, against Japanese invading armies : it was again Brave INDIAN troops, Madam !

6. Whether it was Malaysian Wars in the Jungles, before their independence or war with the Japanese during 2nd World War or Post 2nd World War : the Falkland War, south of Argentina or any such thing , it was fought by the Brave Indian Army or our 1/3rd Gorkha Regimental Troops whom the Britishers had taken with them at the time of Partition/ Independence , whatever you may call please.

7. My next question to you, Madam ! Are you aware of the 2nd "KAALA PAANI " other then the known "KAALA PAANI" in OUR Andaman -Nicobar Islands and how mercilessly, the Britishers used to kill our Krantikaries , Japanese & Irish Prisoners of War & the Irish Nationalists who were siding with India, giving its all out support to Indian Freedom Struggle, within one week of capturing them but our Government has kept this secret from our people since 1947 ? ( Possibly , a very handful of our people may only be aware of this place; I , as a traveller, is one such person )


8. Madam ! Allow me to request you to please go through the entire History of the Invasion of Islam/ Muslim Rulers , their attack on our Indian kings of those times.
Can you site a Single instance of More Cruelity & Barbarism than Muslim rulers in India to the extent that India is the only country in the world where BRAVE HINDU Women were compelled to Sacrifice oneself in the Burning Fire : "SATI" to avoid their perpetual Cruelity : Kindly try to burn even slightest Point of any part of your body : How painful, you will feel ; then the question is why the Hindu Brave women were committing "Sati" . Has any other country in the world has such Brave History , madam ! ( But when it became an Ugly ritual after the death of one's husband, then Maharishi Dayanand & Arya Samaj came to the rescue of Women & fought against this menace till it was completely routed out of our such Barbaric Customs)

Madam, do you know that you are lucky to have been born in present day society, if you were a Hindu woman in those days, the Muslims of that era
would have tied you first on a "rahat" like wheel , then they boil those poor Unfortunate Hindu Girls with Real Hot Steam , all the time poor Hindu girls Crying ,till they submit to their Sexual Un-Natural lusts in the filthiest manners like Inhuman Beasts .

( Even the so called Secular face projected of Akbar "Badshah" was one of the worst rascal Mughal Muslim rulers in India who had projected himself in that manner as if he was "the Most SECULAR" ruler in a some what similar manner, our present UPA govt is projecting their various people including Rajiv Gandhi)

9. Madam ! Have you ever been to Pakistan & Bangladesh, if Not , please do visit these two Islamic so called countries of "PEACE" and see for yrself , how Hindu & sikh girls from your own Gurudwaras in Southall, Middx., London & other places are lured into marrying Muslim boys , who very conveniently sell those Hindu- Sikh Girls to Brothels in Pakistan/ Bangladesh & in other Muslim countries including Malaysia, so called a liberal Country.

PLEASE GO & SEE FOR YRSELF HOW HINDU GIRLS ARE BEING SOLD / AUCTIONED IN THESE MUSLIM COUNTRIES & THEN BELIEVE TO WHAT I AM STATING PLEASE. JUST A QUICK VISIT EVEN TO SAFE ZAVERI BAZAR OF DHAKA SHOULD BE ABLE TO CONVINCE YOU OF MY ABOVE STATEMENT, WHICH I AM MENTIONING JUST AS A TIP OF THE HUGE ICEBERG .

Madam, I can go on & on...., but I bellieve it is enough for now, whenever you feel like , you may talk to me over phone No. given below at the end.

Lastly, in short, allow me to state that none of us is involved in the Crimes , sexual or otherwise as mentioned in yr mail , it is simply a Media gimmick to sell themselves as it is a human tendency to buy bad ( "CHATPATI") news promptly, though in certain cases it may be true also, but then you should remember INDIA is a HUGE Country of well over 1.15 Billion People or more, if at any time such stray incident happens, you can Not blame the whole nation or the whole Hindu Community for it.

Please also note that NONE of the Hindu Parents want to send away or sell their daughters to UK or USA in Marriages as you have stated; it is again a case of mis-representation & wrongly luring the girls & their parents for it; affluent class in india is certainly more guilty in this case, not the poor or middle class , hence, your statement of selling their daughters to UK is certainly wrong, NO ONE WANTS TO SELL THEIR DAUGHTERS/ GIRLS in UK, possibly, you may have a different experience yourself, which if you like, you may elaborate please.

Please also go through various blogs of Agniveer, who was earlier IMAM, a most respectful Clergy in Islam over Maulvies & who had studied Quran 100's of times along with various other religious scriptures: His Actual name was Imam Mehboob Ali for about 40 years , Now Pandit Mahendra Palji Shashtri. Please do send yr questionnaire to him.

Madam , it appears to me that you have NOT met Nor come across Honest , Dedicated & Genuine Hindu People so far , else you would Not have Commented those Fithy Uncivilized remarks in your reply to Shri Aditya Ahuja /Dr.Vivek Arya , blaming the whole Hindu Community .

Regards,
S C Gupta,
Mumbai.
India.
Tel : 982 05 876 09.

From: aditya ahuja
To: Rita Virji ; vivek arya
Cc: aryasamajonline@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, 29 May, 2010 12:53:41 PM
Subject: Re: [aryasamajonline] Re: A Muslim donates Rs1 crore golden crown for Gujarat Hindu Mandir
The language and inferences drawn by Rita Virji
Aditya

--- On Fri, 28/5/10, vivek arya wrote:


From: vivek arya
Subject: Re: [aryasamajonline] Re: A Muslim donates Rs1 crore golden crown for Gujarat Hindu Mandir
To: "Rita Virji"
Cc: aryasamajonline@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, 28 May, 2010, 5:12 PM
is it crime to say an ignorant as a ignorant!

vivek

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From: Rita Virji
To: vivek
Sent: Fri, May 28, 2010 2:20:20 PM
Subject: Re: [aryasamajonline] Re: A Muslim donates Rs1 crore golden crown for Gujarat Hindu Mandir


Do you people just sit there and criticize Muslims?
In which Shashtra it is written that all we have to do is criticize others?
Get a life you lot.

If you spent all the time you are wasting on views on others, on something constructive than our INDIA would not be so backwards. Look at how many Young children are raped every minute in India, how many women are killed by their in-laws.
how many father-in-laws rape their daughter-in- laws.
How many of you lot are guilty of 'selling' your daughters to men in UK/
How many of you lot prefer sons than daughters?
and yet when you bloody lot get old your sons and their wives kick your asses, serves you lot fuckin right.

That is INIDA





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From: vivek
To: aryasamajonline@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Fri, 28 May, 2010 6:00:27
Subject: [aryasamajonline] Re: A Muslim donates Rs1 crore golden crown for Gujarat Hindu Mandir

one doubt!

in which shastras its written that idols need cworn worth ruppes 1 crore.

dr vivek

--- In aryasamajonline@ yahoogroups. com, b s wrote:
> A Muslim
> donates Rs1 crore golden crown for Gujarat Hindu Mandir
>
> A Muslim donor has donated Rs 1 crore for making
> of golden crown for Shri Sahajanand Swami's murti in Gujarat's Kutch.
>
> Dubai based Kutchi-Gujarati businessman Noor Mohammadbhai
> Nazmuddinbhai Bohra offers five time namaz and but believes that a religion
> never bounds a person in limits. Shri Noor Mohammadbhai has donated Rs 1 crore
> from his diamond, gems and precious stone business income for golden crown of
> Shri Sahajanand Swami's murti.
>
> Shri Noor Mohammadbhai will come to Gujarat in
> person and will offer a golden crown to Murti of Sahajand Swami in May 2010.
> This information was given by Shri Dharmananddas
> Swami on the occassion of Vijay Dhvaj Samaroh in Bhuj on Sunday. A grand event
> is scheduled to take place in May 2010 in Bhuj on the occassion of lauching of
> new Swaminarayan Mandir in Bhuj.
>
> http://deshgujarat. com/2010/ 04/29/a-muslim- donates-1- crore-golden- crown-for- gujarat-hindu- mandir/
> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _



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DARK SIDE OF WOMEN EMPOWERMENT!

agrasen

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[aryayouthgroup] Re: [issuesonline_worldwide] Women empowerment: The dark side


Dear members,

It would appear that both Prof. Gupta and Mr. Shadi are right in their own way. No doubt women were kept in 'subjugation' in the past, perhaps mainly because man was the bread earner and the woman was dependent on him. However, in that system while some of the women, mind it not all, suffered dsicrimnation, overall women were far happier and they were raising happy, healthy and wise children.

The woman's emanicipation has certainly overshot and has broken up families, children are like DHOBI KA KUTTA NA GHAR KA NA GHAT KA. While the women are asserting themselves following the western life style, are they any happier? No doubt man suffers much more these days as he does not know from day to day whether he can trust his wife and whether she will return home tonight or if she is not already having an affair, which is not considered immoral or sinful in the modern day education and society! Same applies to men though perhaps to a lesser degree!

So, the whole Indian and other societies are caught up in a catch twentytwo and while women and men are both getting to express themselves, the family life of love, trust and happiness has disappeared for good and things will only get worse with the time as we are in KALIYUG and it is going to be GHORE KALIYUG where while we have the money, positions and what not but no trust, peace or happiness! The frustrated children raised in such families can only have more frustration in their young and youthful life, making them unwise and many of them criminal-minded, etc. etc.

JAI SITARAMJIKI, JAI SHRI RADHAKRISHNJIKI, JAI VEER HANUMAN.

AGRASEN

Dear Prof. Gupta,

I have been reading your mail and kept quite as I felt that you are repeating yourself what you have done in the past few years. since it is summer and vacation time you must not have much to do and maybe summer sun has some effect on you as this letter indicates.

You used to be for rights of women and why this sudden change of hear. You had written before similar anti Women letters but didnot realise your dark side of such hate for emancipation

It is evident that you donot want nation to change and that is why have often complained about people making better wages and enjoying life. You have failed to understand that all nations are changing and you cannot dictated and call these people being selfish or whatever.
Life as it is very hard and it is well known that we have kept our females in the backwaters as we have a built in inferioty complex and keep them 2 steps behind. No one has seen any thing from you about Bride burning incidents or even aborting females but you are in the forefront to tell us what to do and how nation should behave.

It is nice that at least you are following somke western songs and if you realy wish to know about more than listen to country songs and those will tell you what life is all about

Keep cool as it is too hot and let us hope rqains come soon
shadi




--- On Fri, 5/28/10, Prof R K Gupta-India wrote:


From: Prof R K Gupta-India
Subject: [issuesonline_worldwide] Women empowerment: The dark side
Date: Friday, May 28, 2010, 5:14 PM
Everything comes at a cost.So is the woman emancipation.Like western society it has started taking heavy toll in Indian society too.Strained relations,stressed homes notwithstanding twin earning, chasing the dreams and skies,confused and confounded children,insecurity,loneliness and not the least ongoing legal battles for alimony,children and so on..... with our corrupt and inefficient judicial system to add the acidic flavor.
Pangs of separation and the time slipping through fingers that won't return anyway.

Countries like India are blindly aping western culture forgetting the qualities of tolerance,accommodation,adjustment,commitment,loyalty and sacrifice that goes in foundation of 'sweet home'.

There is no point in blaming anyone and any issue.Things are just happening.Courts are full of law suits and complaints.The system is breaking down.The society is being ripped apart in pursuit of imaginary triumph and self righteousness.it is also not important as to who abets to all this.The consequences are terrific.

Here below is a lovely song sung by Christina Aguilera-"Hurt"
I am giving it full length as going through it well depicts the post- separation pains that no amount of money or comforting can match.
This song comes from western society, of course.People there too feel the same.But as they say we are captives of our own device.Society has gone way ahead to return.I hope wisdom prevails.
We can only counsel and spread the message.
Once gone no one can turn back the time..............

***********
*HURT*

Seems like it was yesterday when I saw your face
You told me how proud you were but I walked away
If only I knew what I know today

I would hold you in my arms
I would take the pain away
Thank you for all you've done
Forgive all your mistakes
There's nothing I wouldn't do
To hear your voice again
Sometimes I want to call you but I know you won't be there

I'm sorry for blaming you for everything I just couldn't do
And I've hurt myself by hurting you
Some days I feel broke inside but I won't admit
Sometimes I just want to hide 'cause it's you I miss
You know it's so hard to say goodbye when it comes to this

Would you tell me I was wrong?
Would you help me understand?
Are you looking down upon me?
Are you proud of who I am?
There's nothing I wouldn't do
To have just one more chance
To look into your eyes and see you looking back

I'm sorry for blaming you for everything I just couldn't do
And I've hurt myself
If I had just one more day, I would tell you how much that
I've missed you since you've been away

Oh, it's dangerous
It's so out of line to try to turn back time

I'm sorry for blaming you for everything I just couldn't do
And I've hurt myself

By hurting you

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

DENUNCIATION OF INDIAN CITIZENSHIP

agrasen

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[IndianVoice] Denunciation of Indian Citizenship

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Srinivasan Sashti Wed, May 19, 2010 at 8:52 PM
Reply-To: "H.S.A.Narayana"


Subject: Denunciation of Indian Citizenship
Date: May 19, 2010 11:44 PM
Dear Friends,

I was in for a rude shock when I applied for 10-yer multiple entry visitor visa for my wife to the Indan Consulate in Houston, Texas, under whose jurisdiction we live. We are U.S. citizens having become one, like hundreds fo thousands of many in the U.S., U.K. and other countries of the World. People of Indian Origin! Many,many, many years ago!

My wife was asked to File an Application renouncing her Indian citizenship, pay an application fee for renunciation of US$175.00, in addition to the Visa Application Fee that we already made with our application; we were told that the previous procedure of obtaining a Tourist Visa has been changed as of 18 May 2010, in that all NRIs wishing to travel to India, must seek an Entry Visa (rather than a Tourist Visa), which now has been restricted to:

(a) one time entry - Single Entry Visa
(b) one year multiple entry - Entry Visa
(c) five year multiple entry - Entry Visa
(d) 10-yer Multiple Entry has been dropped!

The fee for Multiple Entry Visa for five years has been increased to US$223.00. Up until that time, it used to be $175.00 for a 10-year Multiple Entry Tourist Visa! The fees has actually been doubled

We were also required to furnish with the Application the last issued and used Indian Passports! In most cases, people are required to surrender the Indian Passports to the U.S. Immigration at the time of one's Naturalization as a U.S. citizen. Some people have discarded their old Indian passports, 10-15-20 years ago, since they thought the old passports would never be required. Fortunately, in our case,we had saved it!

In case you have not discarded your old Indian Passports or relinquished it to the U.S. Immigration at the time of "Swearing-in" for Naturalization process, please save them, because the next time you go to renew your entry visa to India, you will be asked to file the Renunciation Application of your Indian Citizenship, pay a $175 filing fee for such renunciation and then send them the old Indian Passport to prove that you were formerly an Indian citizen!

We felt like we were being held "over the barrel" by the Indian Government by fleecing the NRI's from banishing them from entering into India! (by making them pay $175 towards renunciation fee!

Where does this leave all the NRI's (citizens of U.S.A., U.K., European Countries, Australia, New Zealand, Canada), of Indian origin?. I thought the Expats were being lured to become Non-Resident Indian citizens with a Card that permitted them to stay longer (beyond six months) in India, enter into India freely without a visa, to bring in foreign investment climate and all that?

If persons of Indian origin, holding foreign citizenship are now required to renounce their Indian citizenship, where does it leave US, and other Expatriate Indians, the World over?!

I would welcome some G.O., that the Ministry of External Affairs may have issued in this regard for the enlightenment of all Expats the World over!

Welcome back to India, renouncing your Indian citizenship! ExPats! You'll soon be issued a New Card called terming all of us as "Renounced Indian Citizens" (RIC's)! for which you will be charged an application fee of $500.

V. Srinivasan
3614 Columbia Boulevard
Garland, Texas 75043
U.S.A.
tel: 1-972 840 3495



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HAPPY BUDDHA PURNIMA

agrasen

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Fwd: [Uttishthata] BUDDHA POORNIMA

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vijay ashar Thu, May 27, 2010 at 11:24 AM
To: "N. G. Ashar"
Cc: Hom Bahmanyar , Swami Nishthatmananda
Wishing you a Blessed Buddha PurNima.

My efforts and aspirations for furthering my spiritual progress in this life are nearing an end. My body and mind no longer support me to continue my journey further. I hope i can sustain my faith in Shri Krishna's assurance in B. Gita that whatever little good i may have done in this life, and avoid doing harm to anyone despite many temptations, will accompany me in my soul journey beyond, and will carve my Destiny in another life with a new set of opportunities.

न हि कल्याणकृत कश्चित् दुर्गतिम तात गच्छति I (Note: 'त' and 'म' should be with हलांत)


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Swami Nishthatmananda
Date: Wed, May 26, 2010 at 2:26 AM
Subject: [Uttishthata] BUDDHA POORNIMA
To: Uttishthata@yahoogroups.com















BUDDHA POORNIMA - 27TH MAY 2010

Taking a last look at his new-born son and implanting a kiss on the feet of his wife, a prince of 29 years old came out of his palace at the dead of night and mounted on his dear horse in search of real happiness.


The next 6 years of extreme spiritual exercises costed the body of the prince heavily thus making him to forego the path of extreme hardships and choose the middle path between self-indulgence and self-mortification by accepting rice porridge from a village girl.



The prince sat under a pipal tree with a firm resolve to realize the truth.



What was his resolve?



“Let my body dry up, as it were on this seat, let the flesh thereof and the bone sink into dissolution; without realizing that Enlightenment which is difficult to attain even in aeons, this body shall not rise from its seat.



49 days thus rolled off.



On the 50th day, the 35 years old prince became the enlightened one, the Buddha.



That was on Vaishaki Poornima day at Gaya, 2600 years ago.









Bahujana hitaya bahujana sukhaya,lokanukampaya,

arthaya hitaya sukhaya devananussanam



“for the good of many, for the happiness of many, for showing compassion to the world, for realizing the spiritual purpose of life, for your own good and as well as the god and happiness of all men and gods you have to dedicate your lives.”





Those were the words of Buddha to those who were around him on that day.



The next 45 years saw Buddha leaving no stone unturned in spreading his message of universal love.



Buddha spoke in the language then current in eastern India, Magadhi Prakrit.



He came out with his 4 noble truths.



1) Suffering is an inherent part of existence

2) The origin of suffering is ignorance the main symptoms of which are attachment and craving.

3) The cause of suffering can be removed.

4) The way for its removal is “Ashtangika marga – eight fold path”











The components of Ashtangika Marga are:



1) right understanding

2) right thought

3) right speech

4) right action

5) right livelihood

6) right effort

7) right mindfulness and

8) right concentration





The elapse of 2600 years brings us the common obstacle of “samsaya – doubtfulness about its present applicability” in our minds. Let’s see what the recent incarnations say about Buddha.



Sri Ramakrishna, the avatara varishtha – the bst among incarnations, believed that the incarnation of Buddha continued to be manifest even then in the image of Puri of the “three gems” in the forms of Jagannath, Subhadra and Balaram. On another occasion upon seeing the drama “Buddhacharita” staged by Girishchandra Ghosh, Sri Ramakrishna remarked, “It is certain that Buddha was an incarnation of God. There is no difference between the faith founded by him and the Vedic path of knowledge.”





Swami Vivekananda in his later days narrated his vision of Bhagawan Buddha in the following words:



“One day, when I was sitting …I saw the extraordinary figure of a monk appear suddenly, from where I did not know, and stand before me at a little distance filling the room with a divine effulgence. He was in ochrecloth with a Kamandalu in his hand. His face bore such a calm and serene expression of inwardness born of indifference to all things that I was amazed and felt much drawn towards him. He walked forward towards me with a slow step, with his eyes steadfastly fixed on me, as if he wanted to say something. But I was seized with fear and could not keep quiet. I got up from my seat, opened the door and walked out of the room with rapid step. The next moment I thought,” Why this foolish fear?” I made bold and went back into the room to hear the monk, who, alas, was no longer there. I waited long in vain and felt dejected, repenting that I had been stupid enough to fly away without listening to him. I have seen many monks, but never have I found such an extraordinary expression in any other face. That face has been indelibly imprinted in my heart. It may be a hallucination, but very often it comes to my mind that I had the good fortune of seeing Lord Buddha that day.”







Vivekananda was fond of addressing Buddha as “the great preacher of the brotherhood of mankind.”



“Among all the prophets of mankind here was a man who never had any cobwebs in his brain and who was sane and strong “said Vivekananda.



Tibetan Spiritual leader Dalial Lama will inaugurate the country’s first-ever Buddha Smiriti Park, sprawling 22 acres, in the heart of the city of Patna on Thursday morning, the 27th May 2010, the Budhha Poornima Day. The first-of-its kind park will house a 200-ft stupa containing holy relics from Japan, Thailand, Myanmar and South Korea and two saplings, one of the Mahabodhu Tree of Gaya and another from Sri Lanka.





The sight of an old man, a sick person, a dead body and a monk just only for one time was sufficient for a 29 year old prince Siddharth who was having all wealth and sense pleasures around him to understand the depth of all worldly pleasures.



6 years of hard austerities gave him the right direction in his search for Truth.



50 days was enough for him to have the Truth in experience.



May all of us pray for His blessings and love in realizing the Truth in this birth itself.!





Swami Nishthatmananda of Muzaffarpur



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AMAZING CUCUMBER

agrasen

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[OurExtendedUNFamily] The Amazing Cucumber

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dayawanti D'Sa Thu, May 20, 2010 at 10:29 AM
To: agrasen



---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Dayawanti D'Sa
Date: Wed, May 5, 2010 at 10:48 AM
Subject: The Amazing Cucumber
To: ourextendedunfamily






The Amazing
Cucumber


This
information was in The New York Times several weeks ago as
part of their "Spotlight on the Home" series that
highlighted creative and fanciful ways to solve common
problems.

1. Cucumbers contain most of the
vitamins you need every day, just one cucumber contains
Vitamin B1, Vitamin B2, Vitamin B3, Vitamin B5, Vitamin B6,
Folic Acid, Vitamin C, Calcium, Iron, Magnesium, Phosphorus,
Potassium and Zinc.


2. Feeling
tired in the afternoon, put down the caffeinated soda and pick
up a cucumber. Cucumbers are a good source of B Vitamins
and Carbohydrates that can provide that quick pick-me-up that
can last for hours.


3. Tired of your
bathroom mirror fogging up after a shower? Try rubbing a
cucumber slice along the mirror, it will eliminate the fog and
provide a soothing, spa-like fragrance.



4. Are grubs and slugs ruining your
planting beds? Place a few slices in a small pie tin and your
garden will be free of pests all season long.
The
chemicals in the cucumber react with the aluminum
to give off a scent
undetectable to humans but drive
garden pests crazy and make them flee the area.



5. Looking for a fast and easy way to
remove cellulite before going out or to the pool? Try rubbing
a slice or two of cucumbers along your problem area for a few
minutes, the phytochemicals in the cucumber cause the collagen
in your skin to tighten, firming up the outer layer and
reducing the visibility of cellulite. Works great on
wrinkles too!!!


6. Want to
avoid a hangover or terrible headache? Eat a few cucumber
slices before going to bed and wake up refreshed and headache
free. Cucumbers contain enough sugar, B vitamins and
electrolytes to replenish essential nutrients the body lost,
keeping everything in equilibrium, avoiding both a hangover
and headache!!


7. Looking to
fight off that afternoon or evening snacking binge?
Cucumbers have been used for centuries and often used by
European trappers, traders and explores for quick meals to
thwart off starvation.


8. Have an
important meeting or job interview and you realize that
you don't have enough time to polish your shoes? Rub a
freshly cut cucumber over the shoe, its chemicals will provide
a quick and durable shine that not only looks great but also
repels water.


9. Out of WD 40
and need to fix a squeaky hinge? Take a cucumber slice
and rub it along the problematic hinge, and voila, the
squeak is gone!

10. Stressed out and don't have
time for massage, facial or visit to the
spa? Cut up
an entire cucumber and place it in a boiling pot of water, the
chemicals and nutrients from the cucumber with react with the
boiling water and be released in the steam, creating a
soothing, relaxing aroma that has been shown the reduce
stress in new mothers and college students during final
exams.

11. Just finish a business lunch
and realize you don't have gum or mints? Take a slice of
cucumber and press it to the roof of your mouth with your
tongue for 30 seconds to eliminate bad breath, the
phytochemicals will kill the bacteria in your mouth
responsible for causing bad breath.

12.
Looking for a 'green' way to clean your faucets, sinks or
stainless
steel? Take a slice of cucumber and rub
it on the surface you want to
clean, not only
will it remove years of tarnish and bring back the
shine, but is won't leave streaks and won't harm you
fingers or fingernails while you
clean.


13. Using a pen and made a
mistake? Take the outside of the cucumber and slowly use it to
erase the pen writing, also works great on crayons and markers
that the kids have used to decorate the
walls!!


Pass this along to
everybody you know who is looking for better and safer ways to
solve life's everyday
problems..

Have a great day.








--------------------------------------------------------------------------------






--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MASTER'S FAVORITE

agrasen

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[seattleseva] The Master's favorite

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JaiGuruDev Mon, May 24, 2010 at 9:26 AM
To: seattleseva@yahoogroups.com








The Master’s favorite

Sri Sri: Once upon a time, there lived a great sage named Angirasa in a forest. He had many disciples. All of them were considerably benefited by his wisdom. However, there were some pious souls, who learned everything faster than others, and followed his words more closely. They also received respect from other disciples for their pious nature.

But, some of the disciples who were dull-witted, developed jealousy towards those pious ones, forgetting the fact, that they alone were at fault for their slow rate of absorption of the master's teachings. Instead, they began doubting the master's impartiality. They felt that the master was imparting special knowledge to the pious ones secretly.

So, one day, when the master was alone, they went to him and said, "Oh, master! We feel that you are being unfair to us. We think that you are giving the full benefit of your wisdom only to a few chosen ones. Why can't you extend similar privileges to us also?"

The master was slightly taken aback by these words, but he calmly replied: "I have treated all of you alike and have never shown any special favours to anyone. If some of you progress fast, it is only due to your own feelings of closeness to my words. Who prevented you from taking more initiative?"

But the disciples were not convinced. Hence after some thought, the master said: "Alright, I will give those of you, who complain, the special attention you want, but on one condition. I will give you a small and simple test, and you must pass it. The test is that you should go to the nearby village, which you often visit, and bring me one good fellow. That's all."

The grumbling ones were overjoyed at the fact that the test was so simple, while its reward would be so immense. They selected one of them, who immediately started his search with much enthusiasm, feeling very sure of catching a good fellow. But to his misfortune, wherever he went and whomever he met, everyone seemed to have some sin or crime to his credit. After a long and fruitless search, and being completely disappointed, he returned to his group and to his master. With frustration he said: "Oh master, I am sorry to tell you that there is not a single good person in the whole village. Everyone has committed a bad deed, crime or sin. The entire village is full of bad people. "Oh, is it so?" the master said with mock sorrow. "Now let me see. We will send one of those, against whom you have a grouse."

He then called one of the pious ones and said, "Can you please go to the nearby village, visited by the other disciple, and bring with you a bad fellow". "With your blessings, I will try, sir," said the pious one and went away on his errand.

The grumbling disciples were again taken by surprise and said, "Oh master! This time also you have been unfair to us! The other fellow will certainly bring dozens of bad fellows, as the village overflows with them!"

However, the master counseled patience, and after due time, the pious one also returned empty-handed, to the shock of the grumbling ones. He made obeisance to the master and said, "Oh, master! I am sorry to disappoint you. I searched the entire village, but could not find a single bad fellow".

The grumbling ones rolled with laughter at this remark, but he continued, "Everyone seemed to have done one good thing or another. I could not get even a single person, who did not do any good deed. Pardon me for my failure. " So saying, he left the place with the permission of the master. To the shocked and surprised grumbling disciples, the master said, "My dear devotees! This is where discretion moves between good and evil, right and wrong, positive and negative. Your wisdom blossoms, when you find a spark of virtue in everything, and it withers away, when you spot a vice in everything. The world is a mixture of joy and grief, and your wisdom depends on what you choose to take out of it. People, who adopt a positive attitude in life, progress fast. But those, who adopt a negative attitude, can only proceed slowly, if at all. For the master, everyone is dear and near; it is only the disciple's fault, if he feels far from him. The more you feel one with me the greater is your evolution. Let all your actions conform to this basic understanding."

This story reveals, how one should face life and its problems. It also shows, how total surrender to a master helps a person to overcome the problems of life more easily.

Jai GuruDev

FOR INDIANS WHO ACQUIRED FOREIGN CITIZENSHIP:

agrasen

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NEW REGULATIONS FROM THE INDIAN CONSULATES.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Krishnaswamy Narasimhan Mon, May 24, 2010 at 2:05 PM
To: Krishnaswamy Narasimhan
Dear Insafcan,
A couple of weeks back, the Indian Consulate started implementing a retrograde action in insisting on making a Renunciation request by paying $175.00 for all Indians who have opted for foreign citizenship. There are lots of confusion regarding the applicability of the stipulations. I have been corresponding with the consulate here without any fruitful response. I would like to discuss this in our INSAF meeting on 25th May. In the meantime, please sign this online petition to register our protest.
Krishnaswamy.



Opposition to Retroactive Enforcement of New Rules for Surrender of Indian Passport. Visit PetitionOnline at http://www.PetitionOnline.com/ip100521/petition.html.



Global Organization of People of Indian Origin (GOPIO) Inc.
PO Box 560117 New York, New York 11356 USA
Web: www.gopio.net, E-mail: gopio-intl@sbcglobal.net Tel: +1-818 708-3885


FOR IMMEDIATE ATTENTION OF NRI AND PIOs


NEW GOVERNMENT OF INDIA RULES CREATE UNDUE HARDSHIPS FOR OVERSEAS INDIANS WHO HAVE BECOME NATURALIZED CITIZENS OF OTHER COUNTRIES

The Global Organization of People of Indian Origin (GOPIO International) strongly objects to the retroactive enforcement of rules regarding the surrender of Indian passport by those who have acquired citizenship of other countries. The new rules impose undue and unnecessary burden on Persons of Indian Origin. Also, the prescribed fee of $175 (USD) is atrociously high.

The notice posted on the website of several Indian embassies and consulates stipulates that Persons of Indian Origin who have acquired citizenship of other countries are required to surrender their Indian passports within 90 days of their acquisition of citizenship of the countries of their adoption and obtain 'Surrender Certificate' from the nearest Indian Consulate. There should not be any objection in surrendering the old Indian passport. However, the new rules should not be applied retroactively.Retroactive enforcement of the new rules and requiring people of Indian origin who got citizenship of other countries years ago, to obtain "surrender Certificate" by paying hefty service fee and penalty for not surrendering within certain time is a rule that is unwarranted, burdensome and not well thought out. In the meantime, a person of Indian origin applying for an Indian visa, OCI/PIO card or wanting other consular services is denied any such service without complying with the new rules.

Per Section 9 of the Citizenship Act 1955, "Any citizen of India who by naturalization, registration or otherwise voluntarily acquires, or has at any time between the 26th January, 1950 and the commencement of this Act voluntarily acquired, the citizenship of another country shall, upon such acquisition or, as the case may be, such commencement, cease to be a citizen of India." Thus, Indians who have acquired citizenship of other countries are covered under Section 9 and their Indian citizenship is automatically terminated on acquiring citizenship of another country. The same Act has provisions for renouncing citizenship of India. Per Section 8,"any citizen of India of full age and capacity, who is also a citizen or national of another country, makes in the prescribed manner a declaration renouncing his Indian citizenship, the declaration shall be registered by the prescribed authority; and, upon such registration, that person shall cease to be a citizen of India." Renunciation of citizenship has to be applied on a prescribed form, while automatic termination of citizenship, covered under Section 9, requires no formal application to the Indian government.

There are a few millions of people who have obtained citizenship of other countries over the last fifty five years, since the passage of Indian Citizenship Act 1955. The Indian Passport does not contain any instruction for surrender (per Passport issued in 1974 by Indian Consulate in the US) except the ones issued by the High Commission of India in Canada which stamps passports with warning that states, "If the holder acquires nationality of another country, he should surrender this passport forthwith to the nearest Indian Mission abroad." Many of the former Indian citizens have been travelling to India on passports of countries of their adoption but with Indian visas granted by the same consulates whose websites now have postings of new rules. If the law or rules did exist in the past, Indian embassies and consulates everywhere should have asked for the surrender of Indian passports before granting Indian visas for the first time to Persons of Indian Origin who had acquired citizenship of other countries. Requiring surrender of Indian passports after the lapse of many years of acquisition of such citizenship, would cause undue hardship and delay in getting consular services.

The new rules also require that an applicant who has lost, damaged or surrendered his/her Indian passport to a foreign Government, he/she should furnish certified copies of the following documents:

Details of last held Indian passport (Passport No., Date of Issue & Place of issue). The onus of providing details rest on the applicant.
Official documents submitted to authorities of new country at the time of obtaining citizenship/naturalization & documents used for entry such as US Form I -130.
Notarized letter explaining reasons for loss.
Police report.

A large majority of the new citizens did not have any use for their old Indian passports and may have lost, misplaced or never kept in their possession after naturalization. The production of items 1 and 2 above, in particular, will not be easy and could take months to obtain from the immigration authorities. In the meantime, consular services will not be available to visit the mother country, even for emergency situations.

The Government of India is urged to reconsider the retroactive enforcement of the new rules as many thousands of people who have acquired citizenship of other countries could suffer undue and unnecessary hardship for no fault of their own. Indians who have been naturalized for years should be given the same 90 days to obtain "surrender certificate" as being allowed to those Indians who become citizens of other countries now and heretofore, without fees and penalties. The minimum service fee of $175 (USD) for the surrender certificate is also very high and should be reduced to a reasonable amount of $25 (USD).

GOPIO urges Indian community groups, organizations and individuals to join in protesting against the new rules by writing to the Secretary, Ministry of External Affairs (MEA) at psfs@mea.gov.in and Secretary Ministry of Overseas Indian Affairs (MOIA) at secretary@moia.nic.in with a copy to GOPIO at GOPIO-Intl@sbcglobal.net.

GOPIO is a non-partisan, non-sectarian global organization with chapters in several countries, actively promoting the interests of people of Indian origin worldwide by monitoring and addressing current critical issues of concern, and by enhancing cooperation and communication between groups of Indians living in various countries.

**

For more information, please contact Inder Singh, Chairman of GOPIO International at +1-818-708-3885, Email: GOPIO-Intl@sbcglobal.net

GOPIO has initiated a PetitionOnline to be submitted to the Prime Minister of India.

Visit
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/ip100521/petition.html. If you agree on this petition, please sign and show your support.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PRESIDENT OBAMA'S SPEECH

agrasen

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fw: WOW.. This is unbelievable.... Watch this QUICKLY

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
bhagavaandaas tyaagi Sun, May 23, 2010 at 6:18 PM
To: bhagavaandaas@yahoo.ca






AMERICAN PRESIDENT OBAMA'S SPEACH



----- Forwarded Message ----
From: BJ Mistry
Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 6:49:24 PM
Subject: Fw: WOW.. This is unbelievable.... Watch this QUICKLY



--- On Sun, 5/23/10, Kishor wrote:


From: Kishor
Subject: WOW.. This is unbelievable.... Watch this QUICKLY
To: "Bhanubhai B. Pandya" , "Bharatbhai H. Shah" , "Dinesh Pandya" , "Dr. Mahendra C Mehta" , "Manikaka Patel" , "Parulben Mehta" , "PIYUSH MEHTA" , "Shaheriyar Byramjee" , "Siddharth Dave" , "SUNILBHAI PATEL" , "Umeshbhai Yagnik" , "Vasantbhai Mistry" , "Bhikhubhai Mistry" , "Anilbhai Shah"
Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 5:04 PM








----- Original Message -----
From: Shantilal Valand
To: valand.10@tiscali.co.uk
Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2010 6:28 PM
Subject: FW: WOW.. This is unbelievable.... Watchthis QUICKLY







Subject: WOW.. This is unbelievable.... Watchthis QUICKLY




Just confirms what we knew.Amazing how the Yanks were duped by this man!!They feel the change!!! Do our Indian politicians have the guts to talk like this about Sanatan Dharma!!!!!










THIS IS A GOOD VIDEO TO WATCH...
IS IT A GOOD EDITING JOB OR FOR REAL ?
ENJOY !
(A NEW PERSPECTIVE)



This is "supposedly" the video that FOX NEWS has been trying to show that is constantly blocked by the administration.


Watch this QUICKLY--before it gets Pulled



http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=tCAffMSWSzY#t=28












































































--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HINDU MULLAYAM, HINDU LALLU, GOVT. OFF THE PEOPELE, BUY THE PEOPLE

<<<<< Back To Home
From Saraswati to cesspit – McCarthy-ian fall of a Hindu mind – 3
Radha Rajan
20 May 2010
Excellent article. Keep it up.
Venkat
20 May 2010



>>>"It remains to be seen what Hindu India and Putin’s Russia want "<<<< _____ 'Hindu' Mullayam, 'hindu' Lallu and the Govt- 'off the people, buy the people and fraud people', elected by 'Hindu' India, apparently wants to be fodder to the cultists of christianity, islam, communism and capitalism. Rather, they already are. The cultists are now chewing fodder, to be digested. Surprising that the learned author is yet unaware of the wants of 'hindu' india.
Incognito
20 May 2010



Lallus and Mullus are only pickpocketeers. But Raja true to his name is king-of-looting who does in % of GDP. Even mayavati is zero in front of him
sivakumar
20 May 2010



Radha, let me repeat the question. For whom are you writing all this nation, nationhood, nationalism books and articles? We Hindus are soul and brain dead.
S Bhavatharini
21 May 2010



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Solzhenitsyn, nationalism sans geopolitics

America and Europe did not expect Putin’s Russia to rise up from the ashes of the Soviet Union; a Russia that looked increasingly like her old self – not only putting the steel of national pride and resolve back in the spines of her people, but also asserting herself in world affairs. This Russia did by surmounting a self-inflicted suicidal handicap of loss of national territory; and this Russia did because Vladimir Putin realized not only the merits of Rebuilding Russia but also its gross errors in judgment and set himself to the task of regaining Russia’s sphere of influence in the former Soviet republics.



While it is true that Rebuilding Russia gave the floundering nation a sense of purpose and set realistic goals for national resurgence, Solzhenitsyn played right into the hands of America and Europe when he advocated the dismemberment of the Soviet Union. Russia was Imperial Russia from the days of Peter the Great and the Russian Empire at its peak was second only to the Mongol Empire, and in history only the third largest empire after the British and Mongol empires.



It is important to observe that unlike the British ‘Empire’, the Russian Empire was one vast expanse of contiguous territory. From the reign of Peter the Great (1672-1725) until the reign of Alexander III (1818-1894), father of the last Tsar Nicholas II, the small Muscovite duchy extended east and west, north and south until it included much of Central Europe and Central Asia.



After 1917, the Russian republic was the seat of Soviet power and a thinker of Solzhenitsyn’s mettle should have known that rebuilding this shattered nation not only entailed rebuilding the nation internally, but also restoring her former status in international politics. In 1990, when he wrote Rebuilding Russia, it would appear that even after living in the US for twenty years, Solzhenitsyn did not understand that size mattered if a country had to be a force to be reckoned with in geopolitics; he also did not understand that in geopolitics, a nation never surrenders any asset which its adversary continues to possess in any measure.



Kautilya defined nation or rashtra as being both the territory and the people belonging to that territory. This means the real and only wealth of a nation is her territory and her people; all other wealth and well-being derive from here. Solzhenitsyn may not have had the benefit of Kautilya’s wisdom, but having known two superpower nations from close quarters, it is baffling why he advocated dismemberment of the Soviet Union when the US not only retained all its territory, but was aggressively expanding its sphere of influence across continents.



Solzhenitsyn’s answer to this baffling question is contained in Rebuilding Russia and reveals that Solzhenitsyn may have been a nationalist, but he had no sense of geopolitics; and in the times when he wrote his essay, the internal affairs of any country was closely linked to geopolitics, specifically superpower determined geopolitics.



When Solzhenitsyn made the horrendous mistake of asking for the disintegration of the Soviet Union, he was asking for a unipolar world with America constituting the only and as would soon be realized, megalomaniac pole. We are forced to conclude that Solzhenitsyn either had no sense of geopolitics or did not want to do geopolitics.



Peoples of non-Abrahamic religions and civilizations understand ‘nation’ differently from those professing the Abrahamic faiths. While Hindus describe their nation in terms of what unites people through commonly shared beliefs, values, and worldview determined by the unique concept of Dharma, peoples of Abrahamic faiths fragment themselves on the basis of how minutely they differ from each other.



And that is why separatism and secessionism are inherent to Christians and Muslims, and that is why the US and the Vatican conspired together to dismember the Soviet Union and the Communist Eastern Bloc.



“Any ancient and deeply rooted, autonomous culture, especially if it is spread on a wide part of the earth's surface, constitutes an autonomous world” is Solzhenitsyn’s definition for what constitutes a nation; and by this definition Russia was a nation, he told his audience in Harvard. But Huntington went far beyond Solzhenitsyn in his essay on the clash of civilizations and placed Russia within the larger context called ‘Orthodox’; this referred to nations whose people belonged to the Eastern Orthodox Church.



Solzhenitsyn described the basis of Russian nationhood as being Slavic and Orthodox. The communist bloc comprised the Soviet Union, China, and countries of Eastern Europe and Asia. While East Germany, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Bulgaria, and Yugoslavia were placed in the Russian orbit by virtue of their being, in the main, Slavic people, North Korea and Vietnam were placed in the Chinese sphere of influence, again by virtue of racial and civilisational kinship.



The Slavs constitute the largest ethnic and linguistic group in Europe and are broadly categorized as the eastern (Russian, Ukrainian and Belorusssian) Slavs, western (Czech, Slovak, Slovene and Lusatian and other small groups in East Germany) Slavs and ‘Yugo’ or southern Serbs, Croats, Bulgars, Bosniaks, Montenegrins and Macedonian Slavs. As mentioned earlier, people of the Abrahamic faiths have zero tolerance to differences or the ‘other’ and the Slavic people, like other ethnic linguistic groups in Europe, fragmented themselves further on the basis of religion, language and culture.



The Slavic people’s religion and culture may be categorized in two broad groups – that which was derived from the Catholic Church, and that from the Eastern Orthodox Church. The intra-Christian religious/cultural divide is further heightened by the difference in script: Eastern Orthodox countries use the Cyrillic (an adaptation of the Greek script), named after the two brothers Cyrill and Methodius from Thessaloniki, Greece, who brought Christianity to the Slavic people; the Catholic countries use the Roman script.



America, EU and the Vatican were the only winners when the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia disintegrated into fragments. From the debris of these two nations arose new Catholic nation-states – Croatia, Poland, the Czech Republic, Slovakia and Slovenia. The mighty Soviet Union, the successor to Imperial Russia, had ceased to be and the world was left to confront an ascendant, belligerent and now unchallenged bully trio – America-NATO, Europe-EU and the Vatican-WCC dichotomies.



They were all Slavs, they were all Christians – Serbs, Croats, Slovaks, Slovenes, Ukranians and Belorussians; and yet, the US and the Vatican and even Solzhenitsyn did not see them as one people; the US and the Vatican because their intent was diabolical, while Solzhenitsyn was trapped in the mindset caused by his suffering in the Gulag. New countries were created from old – denominational countries, language countries and countries like Kyrgyzstan which like Pakistan was just so much territory, important only for its geographic positioning as watch tower overlooking China.



After all, how were Russians, Ukranians and Belorussians different from each other, how were the Serbs different from the Croats, the Czech from the Slovaks or both from the Slovenes? The idea behind disintegrating these two countries was simply to move the fragments within the orbit of the Vatican, NATO, EU and WTO. In short, tear them apart for the vultures to prey upon. While America inherited the world, Europe picked up the rubble from the debris.



Solzhenitsyn brilliant essay may have been titled Rebuilding Russia but it suffered from Solzhenitsyn’s partial vision. Having lived in the US for twenty years, Solzhenitsyn experienced both the virtues and evils of western polity and culture. When communism ended, and with it the Soviet Union, Solzhenitsyn was afraid of Russia being overrun by Europe and Americanism and that is why he cautioned Russia’s leaders and her people against seeking the easy way of west-is-best for rebuilding the country.



It is here that one confronts Solzhenitsyn’s existential dilemma – was Russia just another European entity or was she different? Solzhenitsyn asserted that Russia was not just any other western country but had a distinct identity of her own, a racial and religious identity: Slavic and Orthodox. He was not the first to define Russia thus. Tsar Nicholas I and later Tsar Alexander III and thinkers like Kropotkin and Bakunin all described Russia as Slavic and Eastern Orthodox.



The idea being – they were a distinct race and they had a distinct religion. What strikes us is that they all, including Solzhenitsyn, saw Russia as European and within Europe, as a distinct nation. But this is simply not true; even if one did not include the Ukraine and Belorus, less than one-third of Russia is on the European side. Divided neatly by the Ural mountain range, most of Russia is in Asia.



The Imperial Russian Empire extended as deeply into Central Asia as it did into Central Europe and so, at least from the time of Peter the Great, the peoples of Soviet Union and Eastern Europe have shared common history. More pertinently, the ruling Russian Slavic race has no documented history prior to the advent of Christianity into the region in the 9th century. ‘Russian’ has historically included the ‘Great Russians’, the ‘Little Russians’ as Ukranians are affectionately known and Belorussians. Imperial Russia was the huge tree that grew from the seed that was Muscovite Duchy, while Moscow herself was born from the womb of Kiev.



The history of Russia is no different from the history of any Muslim and Christian kingdom and its people; history has always been the story of conquest of territories not their own, and after subjugation of the native peoples, the conquest was completed with imposition of the victor’s religion and culture upon the subject nation. This fact, that Abrahamic empires were not an organic whole, but artificial constructs comprising alien entities will have to be kept in mind when critiquing Solzhenitsyn’s prescription of jettisoning territory as being the first step in restructuring Russia.



Hindu empires were civilisationally different in character because even empires and emperors were subordinate to and subject to Dharma -

Great emperors or Chakravartins brought large parts of this land under their empire; India has experienced Golden Rule under each of these great emperors, a testimony to the deep sense of nationhood in the people of this bhumi. The vijigisu (world conqueror) and the Chakravartin ruling over his mighty empire could effortlessly maintain social stability and harmony only because of this sense of nationhood derived form adherence to sanatana dharma.



The seat of empire has historically moved from the North, to the East, to the West, to the South, and the people of these regions, under different Emperors, have experienced a shared sense of belonging to a nation under the Chandelas, Senas, Palas, Mauryas, Guptas, Marathas, Cholas and Pandyas.



These mighty empires and dynasties welded the people of this bhumi into an organised state only because the people had a sense of common nationhood and, more importantly, the rulers were part of the nation and derived their legitimacy to rule not only because they belonged to the nation they ruled, but also because they subscribed to the civilisational principles and values that defined the sense of nationhood of the people they ruled. (Radha Rajan, Eclipse of the Hindu Nation: Gandhi and his Freedom Struggle, NAPL, 2009, Chapter 4, Gandhian Swaraj - Diminishing the Kshatriya, p168)



Solzhenitsyn advocated disintegration of the Soviet Union for the following reasons –



- Quoting political thinker Sergei Kryzhanovsky, Solzhenitsyn called for jettisoning the Central Asian, Baltic and trans-Caucasian republics on the ground that “the Russian heartland does not possess the reserves of cultural and moral strength necessary to assimilate the peripheries. That [effort] weakens the Russian national core.



- Today’s Kryzhanovsky’s words are a thousand times more valid: We don’t have the strength for sustaining an empire – and it is just as well. Let this burden fall from our shoulders: it is crushing us, sapping our energy, and hastening our demise.



- The time has come for an uncompromising choice between an empire of which we ourselves are the primary victims and the spiritual and physical salvation of our own people.



- Holding on to a great empire means to contribute to the extinction of our own people. And anyway, what need is there of this heterogeneous amalgam? Do we want Russians to lose their unique characteristics? We must strive, not for the expansion of the state, but for clarity of what remains of our spirit. By separating off twelve republics, by this seeming sacrifice, Russia will in fact free itself for a precious inner development, at long last turning diligent attention toward itself.



- The twentieth century Russian philosopher Ivan Ilyin has written that the spiritual life of a nation is more important than the size of its territory or even its economic prosperity; the health and happiness of the people is of incomparably greater value than any external goal based on prestige.



One does not have to amputate one’s limbs to become spiritual or religious. Solzhenitsyn’s condition after release from the Gulag is stunningly similar to Aurobindo’s after he was released from prison on May 6, 1909. Both Aurobindo and Solzhenitsyn turned to religion and spirituality to strengthen them for the ordeal of prison life.



But after they were released from prison, both turned away from public life, both became recluses and both of them privileged religion and spirituality over polity and economy, not only in their private lives, but also offered it as prescription for national life.



The similarity of the paths these brilliant thinkers traversed after release from prison is both striking and tragic because both of them were political thinkers and when both of them shunned politics in favour of spirituality, their nations lost the benefit of their brilliant intellect.



There could be another explanation for Solzhenitsyn’s prescription that Russia must cease to aspire for superpower status if she had to generate the energy required to heal and re-discover her national identity. This explanation may not be as farfetched as it seems. Solzhenitsyn lived in the US during the Reagan years and it was in March 1983 that the Reagan administration fabricated the military fantasy called the Strategic Defence Initiative or Star Wars, a fantasy which not surprisingly was given up when its objective was met.



One insidious and persistent rumour had it that Reagan and Thatcher cooked up the fantastic missile-shield defence programme only to push the Soviet Union into a financially crippling arms race. The thought may have been planted in Solzhenitsyn’s mind then that the Soviet Union must cease to be if Russia had to live. And when Gorbachev begged to be invited to the 17th G7 meeting in London in July 1991, and when the G7 nations refused Gorbachev's plea for more western economic support for his country, Reagan’s diabolic SDI objective had been met. The Soviet Union disintegrated soon after, just as the member countries of G7 had plotted and hoped for.



Solzhenitsyn should have looked at India to know that surrendering territory is not the answer to any problem; Solzhenitsyn only had to turn his eyes to India to know that even after surrendering territory Hindus have not summoned the will to deal ruthlessly with Hinduism’s adversaries nor realized the need to have a self-conscious Hindu state as the ultimate protector of Hindus and Hindu dharma.



Solzhenitsyn’s nationalism was trapped within the Cold War political idiom. He wrote Rebuilding Russia in 1990 and had he not been a recluse and had he observed international affairs closely, he would have realized that no American political thinker or philosopher, no Chinese thinker or philosopher, would write about dismembering their countries as solution to any problem.



The Soviet Union was not a 20th century artificial entity. As mentioned earlier, the Soviet Union and the Communist Eastern Bloc or Eastern Europe resembled the Imperial Russian Empire and except for minor differences, Imperial Russia and the Soviet Union together with the Eastern Communist Bloc were almost congruent. When Solzhenitsyn called for giving up territory he failed to factor in the fact that the small and humble Muscovite duchy became Imperial Russia because her borders had to be pushed to expand until they reached natural defence barriers against invasions – mountains and oceans to the west, east and the south.



When Stalin mobilized his countrymen to dig their feet in until Hitler’s Nazis died from the cold, he was doing only what Imperial Russia during the reign of Tsar Nicholas I did to Napoleon in 1812. National pride and national resolve even in Stalin’s Russia was the same as it was during the time of Nicholas I. Solzhenitsyn failed to gauge the depth and power of national pride to overcome adversities. Solzhenitsyn, like Aurobindo between 1893 and 1909 could have kindled the fire of national pride and resolve to protect the territorial integrity of his nation; instead he played right into the hands of the US and EU when he called for Russia to sacrifice the empire in favour of spirituality.



Russia had to wait ten long years for a Chandragupta to emerge in the person of Vladimir Putin. Putin heeded Solzhenitsyn’s advice to re-assert Russia’s Slavic and Orthodox identity. But he learnt lessons from Kautilya too. He knew better than Solzhenitsyn that no nation gives up territory and survives; he also knew that an emperor not only ruled directly over conquered territory, but that as emperor he also had to expand his sphere of influence.



Putin’s Russia is slowly but surely beginning to look like Imperial Russia of yore. Putin has reversed every one of the made-in-America coloured revolutions in Central Asia and in the trans-Caucasian republics, intended to isolate Russia physically and deny her access to energy sources and territory for pipelines to transport oil and gas. The US wants a uni-polar world and multi-polar Asia while China wants a uni-polar Asia and multi-polar world. It remains to be seen what Hindu India and Putin’s Russia want and whether they have the political resolve to realize that objective.



(To be continued…)

The author is editor, www.vigilonline.com







<<<<< Back To Home

User Comments:


Excellent article. Keep it up.
Venkat
20 May 2010



>>>"It remains to be seen what Hindu India and Putin’s Russia want "<<<< _____ 'Hindu' Mullayam, 'hindu' Lallu and the Govt- 'off the people, buy the people and fraud people', elected by 'Hindu' India, apparently wants to be fodder to the cultists of christianity, islam, communism and capitalism. Rather, they already are. The cultists are now chewing fodder, to be digested. Surprising that the learned author is yet unaware of the wants of 'hindu' india.
Incognito
20 May 2010



Lallus and Mullus are only pickpocketeers. But Raja true to his name is king-of-looting who does in % of GDP. Even mayavati is zero in front of him
sivakumar
20 May 2010



Radha, let me repeat the question. For whom are you writing all this nation, nationhood, nationalism books and articles? We Hindus are soul and brain dead.
S Bhavatharini
21 May 2010



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PAKISTANIS ARE BECOMING WORLD'S PARIAHS!

agrasen

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FW: Pakistanis are becoming the world's pariahs

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Assudo Bhatia Thu, May 20, 2010 at 5:35 PM
To: agrasen@gmail.com, chetanbhagat1926@yahoo.com, krish45@gmail.com



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From: lbdaswani@hotmail.com
To: lbdaswani@hotmail.com
Subject: Pakistanis are becoming the world's pariahs
Date: Thu, 20 May 2010 04:23:42 +0000


Pakistanis are becoming the world's pariahs?
Opinion: On Being Pakistani
ISLAMABAD (May 16) -- Pakistanis are becoming the world's pariahs. Since
being implicated in a steady stream of violent attacks -- from the London
Tube bombings in 2005 to this month's failed attempt to bomb Times Square --
it seems almost inevitable now that when the next act of terrorism happens,
a Pakistani will be involved.

As a Canadian of Pakistani descent, I've watched this pattern emerge with a
rising sense of trepidation. Thirty-five years ago, when my parents decided
to move to Canada, things were much different. Pakistanis were different.
They were much in demand -- an intelligent, hard-working people who
integrated and contributed positively to society, wherever they went.

What a terrible journey we've made since then.

Today, Pakistanis are objects of fear and suspicion. Wherever we go we must
contend with the "terrorist" label and endure the scrutiny that accompanies
it. Like many of my compatriots, I've been "interviewed" by the Joint
Terrorism Task Force at the U.S. border, questioned at Bangkok's
Suvarnabhumi airport and scrutinized with extra efficiency by a German
border control officer. Every time it happens, a piece of advice a Sufi in
Saudi Arabia once gave me cycles through my mind: "When an obstacle is
placed in front of you," he said, "be like water -- flow around it."

Pakistanis are being asked to flow a lot these days, and it will not get
better any time soon. Many people in the world must be asking why it is that
so many acts of terrorism in the West seem to lead back to Pakistan. Is
there something in the Pakistani psyche that makes them susceptible to
violence?

What those people might be surprised to hear is that Pakistanis are asking
the same questions.

At the forefront is something quite basic: How did this happen? How, in 30
years -- a mere generation -- have Pakistanis gone from being desirable to
becoming undesirables?

The standard narrative goes something like this: During the 1980s, the U.S.
promoted violent jihad in Pakistan to create a proxy army to fight against
the godless Soviets in Afghanistan. The Americans funded the growth of jihad
ideology, encouraged the construction of madrasas -- religious seminaries
that have now become militant birthing grounds -- and are now fighting the
jihadists they helped to create, including Osama bin Laden.

But there is another side to the story. After Soviet troops withdrew from
Afghanistan, Pakistan's military establishment decided to continue using the
jihadists as proxies, both in Afghanistan and in Kashmir. That cold-hearted
act of realpolitik was inspired by a neo-Cold War mentality in which India
was -- and still is -- viewed as an existential threat to Pakistan.

Most Pakistanis feel that America has brought war on them, a war no one here
wanted and which is ultimately killing Pakistanis. But for me, and for a
silent minority of Pakistanis as well, there is an alarming lack of
recognition of the role played by Pakistan's own armed forces and
intelligence agencies in sending Pakistan down the road to jihad.

There are two reasons for this. First, for decades, Pakistan's generals have
diligently maintained the illusion that the army is the only reason Pakistan
has not collapsed. Pakistanis are spoon-fed this false perception from
childhood, indoctrinated into believing that the army is the Great Savior,
the Protector, the Guardian.

Second, opposing the army can have dire consequences. The execution of
former Prime Minister Zulfikar Ali Bhutto in 1979 is one salient example.
The mounting evidence of an army role in the December 2008 assassination of
his daughter, Benazir Bhutto, is another.

Just a few days ago my uncle expressed his concern in connection with the
work I was doing tracing Times Square bomber Faisal Shahzad's militant
connections back to groups linked to Pakistan's dreaded spy service, the
ISI. "You don't understand these people," he warned me. "They can make you
disappear and you will never be found again. No one can stand up to them."

But somebody must stand up to them. Pakistan's image in the world, not to
mention its future, depends on it. Is it an accident that Faisal Shahzad was
the son of a senior Pakistani military officer? I don't think so. Military
culture in this country is virulently anti-American. Couple it with the
rampant spread of jihad ideology -- also the product of the army's failed
policies -- and you end up with a deadly mix.

The failed attack on Times Square is only the tip of the iceberg. The fear
among many Pakistanis is that some similar attempt is likely to succeed.
With each attack, fear and suspicion of any Pakistani is bound to rise. And
the irony is that as Pakistan spirals into chaos, young people here are
increasingly looking to get out.

Two of my cousins are waiting for their immigration papers to be approved in
Canada. They are educated, moderate Pakistani Muslims, much like Shahzad
appeared to be until recently. They worry now that the environment of fear
will hamper their efforts for a better life abroad. My brother, a professor
of biochemistry at Trinity College in Dublin, is planning a sabbatical to
Harvard, but worries about the treatment he'll receive there.

Bearded Pakistanis have been under the microscope for years. Now,
clean-shaven, Ray-Ban-wearing Pakistanis may be in for the same treatment.
My advice to them is to listen to the Sufis. Self-respect lies within the
self; no one can take it away from you. Be like water.
Adnan S. Khan covers Pakistan for AOL News.
Original Source: Opinion: On Being Pakistani by Adnan R. Khan




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The New Busy think 9 to 5 is a cute idea. Combine multiple calendars with Hotmail. Get busy.

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The New Busy think 9 to 5 is a cute idea. Combine multiple calendars with Hotmail. Get busy.


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JAPA MALA

agrasen

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Japa Mala

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Krishnaswamy Narasimhan Wed, May 19, 2010 at 6:18 PM
To: Krishnaswamy Narasimhan
I refer to the article by Mr.Gene D Matlock titled "Did the Hindus help write the Bible" forwarded by me yesterday in which he established the connections between Indians and Mexicans. Here is another piece which goes to prove that Indians indeed migrated to various countries as far as Mexico. You yourself decide.



Fascinating information for those of you who may be interested: and for those of you who are not attracted by Indian lore, do read the first three paras, at least!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

It is amazing how much Western science has taught us. Today, for example, kids in grammar school learn that the sun is 93 million miles from the earth and that the speed of light is 186,000 miles per second. Yoga may teach us about our Higher Self, but it can't supply this kind of information about physics or astronomy.

Or can it? Professor Subhash Kak of Louisiana State University recently called our attention to a remarkable statement by Sayana, a fourteenth century Indian scholar. In his commentary on a hymn in the Rig Veda, the oldest and perhaps most mystical text ever composed in India, Sayana has this to say:
"With deep respect, I bow to the sun, who travels 2,202 yojanas in half a nimesha."

A yojana is about nine American miles; a nimesha is 16/75 of a second. get out your calculators!

2,202 yojanas x 9 miles x 75/8 nimeshas = 185,794 m. p. s.

Basically, Sayana is saying that sunlight travels at 186,000 miles per second! How could a Vedic scholar who died in 1387 A. D. have known the correct figure for the speed of light? If this was just a wild guess it's the most amazing coincidence in the history of science! And Sayana was merely commenting on Rig Veda which was supposedly composed 9000 years ago !!

The yoga tradition is full of such coincidences. Take for instance the mala many yoga students wear around their neck. Since these rosaries are used to keep track of the number of mantras a person is repeating, students often ask why they have 108 beads instead of 100. Part of the reason is that the mala represent the ecliptic, the path of the sun and moon across the sky. Yogis divide the ecliptic into 27 equal sections called nakshatras, and each of these into four equal sectors called paadas, or "steps," marking the 108 steps that the sun and moon take through heaven.

Each is associated with a particular blessing force, with which you align yourself as you turn the beads.

Traditionally, yoga students stop at the 109th "guru bead," also called MERU, flip the mala around in their hand, and continue reciting their mantra as they move backward through the beads. The guru bead represents the summer and winter solstices, when the sun appears to stop in its course and reverse directions. In the yoga tradition we learn that we're deeply interconnected with all of nature. Using a mala is a symbolic way of connecting ourselves with the cosmic cycles governing our universe.

But Professor Kak points out yet another coincidence: The distance between the earth and the sun is approximately 108 times the sun's diameter. The diameter of the sun is about 108 times the earth's diameter. And the distance between the earth and the moon is 108 times the moon's diameter.

Could this be the reason the ancient sages considered 108 such a sacred number? If the microcosm (us) mirrors the macrocosm (the solar system), then maybe you could say there are 108 steps between our ordinary human awareness and the divine light at the center of our being. Each time we chant another mantra as our mala beads slip through our fingers, we are taking another step toward our own inner sun.

As we read through ancient Indian texts, we find so much the sages of antiquity could not possibly have known-but did. While our European and Middle Eastern ancestors claimed that the universe was created about 6,000 years ago, the yogis have always maintained that our present cosmos is billions of years old, and that it's just one of many such universes which have arisen and dissolved in the vastness of eternity.

In fact the Puranas, encyclopedias of yogic lore thousands of years old, describe the birth of our solar system out of a "milk ocean," the Milky Way. Through the will of the Creator, they tell us, a vortex shaped like a lotus arose from the navel of eternity. It was called Hiranya Garbha, the shining womb [womb here means the source, point of origin and not an anatomical reference ] and it gradually coalesced into our world, but will perish some day billions of years hence when the sun expands to many times it present size, swallowing all life on earth. In the end, the Puranas say, the ashes of the earth will be blown into space by the cosmic wind. Today we known this is a scientifically accurate, if poetic, description of the fate of our planet.

The Surya Siddhanta is the oldest surviving astronomical text in the Indian tradition. Some Western scholars date it to perhaps the fifth or sixth centuries A. D., though the text itself claims to represent a tradition much, much older. It explains that the earth is shaped like a ball, and states that at the very opposite side of the planet from India is a great city where the sun is rising at the same time it sets in India. In this city, the Surya Siddhanta claims, lives a race of siddhas, or advanced spiritual adepts. If you trace the globe of the earth around to the exact opposite side of India, you'll find Mexico. Is it possible that the ancient Indians were well aware of the great sages/astronomers of Central America many centuries before Columbus discovered America?- the Mayans or Incas!!!

Knowing the unknowable: To us today it seems impossible that the speed of light or the fate of our solar system could be determined without advanced astronomical instruments.

How could the writers of ancient Sanskrit texts have known the unknowable? In searching for an explanation we first need to understand that these ancient scientists were not just intellectuals, they were practicing yogis. The very first lines of the Surya Siddhanta, informs about the Golden Age when a great astronomer named Maya desired to learn the secrets of the heavens, so he first performed rigorous yogic practices. Then the answers to his questions appeared in his mind in an intuitive flash.

Does this sound unlikely? Yoga Sutra 3:26-28 states that through, samyama (concentration, meditation, and unbroken mental absorption) on the sun, moon, and pole star, we can gain knowledge of the planets and stars. Sutra 3:33 clarifies, saying: "Through keenly developed intuition, everything can be known." Highly developed intuition is called pratibha in yoga. It is accessible only to those who have completely stilled their mind, focusing their attention on one object with laser-like intensity. Those who have limited their mind are no longer limited to the fragments of knowledge supplied by the five senses. All knowledge becomes accessible to them.

"There are those who would say that consciousness, acting on itself, can find universal knowledge, Professor Kak admits.
"In fact this is the traditional Indian view."

Perhaps the ancient sages didn't need advanced astronomical instruments. After all, they had yoga!.

=================================================
Best regards, krish.







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WHY THE WORLD IS A DUKHALAYA?

On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 10:43 AM, agrasen wrote:

Jai Shri Sitaramjiki, Jai Sri Radhakrishnjiki, Jai Veer Hanuman.

My earlier question on Swamiji's suggestion that even though we must treat everyone equally but we can't treat a dog the same, my question was figuratively put, i.e. it is not the question of a dog, cow or another not so good a person, but everyone must be treated by us equanimously with respect and according to their need, without minding any of their bad behaviour, etc. and therefore we should see Vasudev in everyone irrespective of their yoni or conduct.

Referring to Shri Vyasji's response concerning the world, no doubt it is a dukhalaya; God or whoever the power made us all, has left us in a sea of temptations and said keep the end of your shirt dry, don't let it get wet in the water of temptations. The religion says time and again: avoid all temptations while in this world and work for the next life, be honest, diligent, pray, do not have any attachment to anything or anyone. Perhaps all these conditions are more hard to follow fully in order to get moksha and solace in the life hereafter while facing the hardships in this world.

The question no doubt remains why God made the worldly life so full of temptations, leading to sorrows; why could there not be a middle path or an easier path to follow while living in this world and to get moksha or a better life in the hereafter as well. No doubt, the maker of this world had all the power to make things the way he wanted them to be. Right now it is mostly a DUKHALAYA; yehan khushiyan hain kam; beshumar hain gam; and on top of that the fear of the life hereafter. Why Why Why!

JAI SHRI SITARAMJIKI, JAI SHRI RADHAKRISHNJIKI, JAI VEER HANUMAN.

SHER SINGH AGRAWAL


On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 6:47 AM, sadhak_insight wrote:



Divine Sadhaks

My Q is - Why the world has been made as 'Dukhalayam' ( Abode/Home of Sorrows) by Paramatma ?

Vyas N B

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Date: Wed May 19, 2010 7:30 am

Dear All, Vyas ji in particular, Namaskar!I have gone through Vyas Ji few posts in the past which have been usually quite

informative. But, I wonder on his this simple question!!The fact is that Parmatma has not made anything (no creator & creation business,no duality) but Parmatma is by itself anything and everything within

manifestation and beyond. Therefore, in view that Adatava philosophy whatever weconceive, feel and imagine are just properties of Parmatma as said by LordKrishna in Chap. 10 and shown in Chap. 11. All that & everything is governed by

tool known as Individualistic Mind (Individual Consciousness) which is the basefor feeling of Dukh or Sukh as some of the Sadaks too have also pointed out.If the question exactly meant why the world is made, still above answer would

fit in. The other answer could be that it is just a play of Parmatma!! It is only HE which may be named as Parmatma, God, Ram, Krishen, Allah.....soon and so forth. Just my view! Namaskar to conclude

K.K.KAUL
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Date: Wed May 19, 2010 6:35 am
Jai Shree Krishna

Almost all sadhaks are surprisingly unanimous that this world is not MADE 'Dukhalayam' by Paramatma. Wrong ! If that is so, why Gita has defined the world to be dukhalayam? Has Gita not done so? Why there are verses like 13:8 or 14:20 ? Why there is ALWAYS a requirement for every Yogi including Karma, Jnana and Bhakti Yogi to get DISCONNECTED from the world? That your outlook makes it to be sukhalayam or dukhalayam is wrong answer ! IT IS DUKHALAYAM and so DELIBERATELY made by PARAMATMA Himself !! Sadhaks should go deeper and find out reasons as to why this world is made so !

Narain ! Narain !!

Rajendra J Bohra
------------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Wed May 19, 2010 5:30 am
Dear Sir,

The Sorrow and Joy lies in the beholder's mind.

I would invite your kind attention at this very moment when somebody is dying in agony on the deathbed, whereas a beautiful child is just entering this world taking birth, a bride is taking wedding oath with her bridegroom in the presence of holy Agni.

A flower is getting crushed under somebody's feet, at the same time somewhere a bud is blosoming to flower.

Hitesh Mody.


----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed May 19, 2010 2:56 am
Hari Om

This refers to query of Sadhak Agrasen. You can't apply equality among say a dog, a cow and a human. That is not real equality. You have to look at the essence and establish equanimity there not at gross level. You can drink milk of cow but not that of a bitch under the garb of Vasudev Sarvam. Scriptures do not guide you to apply concept of Vasudev Sarvam that casually. It is a unique /special sadhana...the ultimate one...coming to you effortlessly upon certain states as an experience ! In the meantime, You have power of discrimination (Viveka) exclusively given to you in this human life. You must discriminate ! Vasudev Sarvam concept does not get vitiated when you appropriately and differently deal with various people/creatures based on merit. Vasudev Sarvam has to be realised at inner/essence level not at outer/ gross level. For example, you should think that poison is made by Vasudev only...in fact Vasudev resides in it, upto here it is OK, BUT at the same time you should not consume it !!

This world, Divine Sadhaks, has been DELIBERATELY and SPECIFICALLY made by Paramatma with particular characteristics. When sent into this world, there is a special grace of Paramatma on you. You are given weapon of discrimination with you and INBUILT desires in you of 1 To do something 2 To know something and 3 To get something. We MUST know/investigate / think / deliberate as to :

1 Why we are here?

2 Why this world has been made as Dukhalayam?

3 What we should do/know/get ?

Read BG 9:33- Anityam Asukham Lokam Imam Praapya.... ! Here Lord confirms...Yes, Yes... ! I have dropped you in this temporary /perishable/everchanging and PLEASURELESS /Sorrowful world....now .... ??

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

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Date: Wed May 19, 2010 12:19 am
The human mind is programmed. One is enjoying only in contrast to pain. One is not aware that one is bound.
Awareness of the bondage is the end of the bondage.
we feel positive in pleasure, this makes us feel negative in sorrow.
But why sorrow should come?
To tell only that there is nothing positive in pleasure.
Mind is frittering away its energy on its home made idea that 'it should be happy'.
Leaving the comfort of this 'should be' gives clarity and intensity of action.
Now one is open the mystery of Existence.
Y V Chawla
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Tue May 18, 2010 10:55 pm
Jai Hanuman

The Question reminds me of an immortal bhajan of modern time Genius poet: Kavi Pradeep. Note here the prayer to Paramatma in the last lines. Oh ! What a way these poets find to live Gita 13:8 (Dukh doshanu darshanam) :-

HAMNE JAG KI AJAB TASVEER DEKHI, EK HANSATA HAI DUS ROTE HAIN !

I have seen a strange phenomena (picture) about this world. Here as against one laughing , ten are crying !!

HAME HANSATE MUKHADE CHAAR MILE ! DUKHIYAARE CHEHARE HAZAAR MILE !!

HAMNE GIN GIN HAR TAQDEER DEKHI ...EK HANSATA HAI DUS ROTE HAIN !

I found too few laughing faces in this world but saw uncountable crying and sorrowful faces. I checked with each and every one's fate...!

DO EK SUHKI YAHAN LAAKHON MAIN ! AANSOO HAIN KARODON AANKHON MAIN !!

HAMNE DEKHE MAHAL AUR KUTEER DAIKHI ...EK HANSATA HAI DUS ROTE HAIN !

Only one or two among millions are found by me to be happy. I found tears in the eyes of milions and trillions. I saw palaces as well as huts...everywhere the story is same.

KUCHH BOL PRABHU YEH KYAA MAAYA ! TERA BHED SAMAJH MAIN NAA AAYA ... EK HANSATA HAI DUS ROTE HAIN !

O Prabhu ! Tell us as to what is this Maya !! We have not understood the secret behind you (for creating this world like this)....!

So that appears to be the foundation of this Question. Indeed even Lord Rama had similar observations in Yoga Vashishtha ! What do you say Brother Mike ? Does not Yoga Vashishtha start with such emotions only?

Namaste Jee

Jee Jee
Shashikala
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue May 18, 2010 9:56 pm
Hari Om

Thanks Divine Sadhaks for beautiful responses to my Question. I would like to elucidate re my question. At the outset, it is not that God has no role in creating the world as IT IS viz making it as Dukhalayam and Ashashwatham. He always had liberty available of not making it as perishable, ever changing and ever destroying. Is His own Loka as defined in BG 15:6 like this world ? No ! Not all. Is the world defined in BG 9:19/20 like this world ? No...not as brutal as this. THEN why this world is made like this?

This world begins with sorrows and ends in sorrows. Pleasures are merely temporary respites from sorrows. ABSENCE OF SORROW is called pleasure in this world. The tiredness arising out of inability to consume further the worldly bhogas is called SUKHA- as a law in this world. It is not that this world is made neutral, else why it would be perishable, asat, mithya and transient ? Why Gita would advice us all to develop a habit of seeing sorrows in this world (BG 13:8) ? Why Gita would define this world as Dukhalayam ? Why ever there would be a need for renunciation?
Why terms as Compassion, Charity, Sarva Bhoot Hite Rataa, ... would be there at the outset ? From which angle, the world is not Dukhalayam or is Sukhalayam or is depending upon your personal outlook/attitude towards it ? From no angle in fact !! It is not that the character of world changes by your getting equanimous or desireless or Godly !!! You change in that case, not the Dukhalayam called world ! My Q is regarding the world !!!

WHY ? Why disconnection starts from every connection which we make, from the very moment of connection itself ? Why there is NITYA VIYOG with world ? Has anybody been spared from sorrows in this world ? WHY this exceptionless treatment ? Be it Sudama or Sita; Kunti or Arjuna; Raam or Rahim ; Harishchandra or Gandhi....who has not faced sorrows ? Can any one point out a single person who has never faced sorrows during human life ? WHY ? If everybody MUST face sorrows as a law...then that is not out of anybody's choice or way of looking but because of the very structure of the world necessitating the same.

And the world as it is, is definitely made by God (BG 9:7/8/9/10) !

Hence my Question again, Divine Sadhaks : Why God has made this world as Dukhalayam?

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B
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Tuesday, May 18, 2010 11:22 PM
Shree Paramatmane Namah
Thank you Sushilji. It is all the acceptance of the mind. If mind is well, then there is Ganga in the bowl!!! (kathouti). So be it!
Vineet,
Sadhak

-----------------------------------------------------

Date: aum

joy, joy, joy .......................... mike jee ................. the deepest wisdom of the wise ....................

now flowing through Mike jee's pen !

blessed are you ...........

blessed your joyous sharing in the Love for the Beloved !


ah, Beloved ................

will you allow the wisdom to touch your heart

to touch your being; to become your being this once ............. this moment Now !

This Moment Now .............this once !!!

and all the sorrows cease !!!!

yes ...............?

AUM


narinder bhandari


------------------------------------------------

Tue May 18, 2010 1:38 pm
It is a magical world. The world is how you look at it. If you look at it as home of sorrows, it becomes that. If you look at it as a wonderful world, it becomes wonderful.


It is all in the mind.......in your thoughts......home of sorrows...or Heaven....
Change your thoughts.......change your world.....to heaven...now...

Experiment, experience, enjoy....live in happiness......

Note: be patient, give it some time....results are guaranteed......
Sushil Jain


---------------------------------------------------------------------
Tuesday, May 18, 2010 11:54 AM
Jai Shri Hari,
As long as the Jeeva (i.e. embodied soul) has an assumed attachment/SANG with the modes (goodness, passion, ignorance) of the changing one (i.e. nature/PRAKRRITI), the oscillations of the SUKH/Joy and DUKH/Sorrow can not be avoided. The result of attachment/SANG (which is the main quality of the RAJOGUNA) is nothing but DUKH (RAJASASTU PHALAM DUKHAM - GitaJi 14/16). The Supreme does not have anything to do with the SUKH and DUKH the Jeeva is entertaining since eternity and therefore he does not create the "DUKHALAYA". He, being omniscient and the supreme well wisher of all, ONLY facilitates the environment/WORLD to fulfill the supreme demand of the Jeevas struggling to come out of the illusion. Upon realization of the TRUTH, it does not matter whether the Jeeva is on this plane or any other (including hell), It (i.e. Jeeva) always remains with the supreme bliss though he may appear as a normal jeeva.

Thanks & Regards
Niteesh Dubey
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Date: Tue May 18, 2010 11:10 am
Shree Hari

|| Ram Ram ||

Dear brother Mikeji,

Pls. forgive me for my lack of knowledge but in my humble opinion, am not able to see any connection of your response to the question raised by Mr., Vyasji, even though you have provided good information!

It is possible that in these type of situations, Gita-talk moderators may not be sure whether they should post the responses? The fear may be that if not posted, sometimes the Sadhkas could drop out and not respond in future which is not healthy for the Forum.

I would like to reiterate a friendly constructive suggestion to all the Sadhkas to kindly focus the responses which directly relate with the question at hand.

|| Ram Ram ||

Humble regards,


Madan Kaura
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Date: Tue May 18, 2010 9:38 am

Dear Pratap Bhatt-ji. I am not competent to respond to your posting. I am grateful for your appreciation. Different people see the same thing differently. One person has of necessity to see the same thing as different at different ppoint of time. When I look at my body being well or unwell, I am not always thinking about a particular part of the body. I have headache: this may be due to some problem arising first with my stomach or my inner system fighting against an attack of a virus / germ somewhere in the body, may be nose. At some other time I am seeing things differently: when my leg has a pain my hands massage with ointment: hands and legs are seen by me as different. But I am in full knowledge that the body is an integrated whole and living that is the superior existence than living as just a leg or a hand. Similarly, I know that the dog and I are part of an integrated existence that the whole Creation is, yet when the dog attacks me to bite I respond with violence to save myself. At that point I live two separate existences: one of a dog and one of a human being, but I know for sure that just like the millions of cells in the body live an integrated human or dog's body, I anfd a dog are integral part of the entire Creation. It is when I start living an unified existence, I do not anymore fear of the dog biting me and my body getting killed and losing life due to dog-bite infection. Because I know that I continue to live as part of the unified one single existence of Creation: what I thought as a separe I with a body and life has transformed in to some differennt things and continue to remain in the Creation. So, I know if I am able to live the existence as a Single unified entity as the entire Creation including the Creator is, I know more have to see and distinguish separate smaller entities. Unfortunately, I do not yet live like that. But would always cherish that oneday I will live like that merged into the unified existence. Then, only I will have no ego, no desire, no connection with what the senses, intellect and mind do and hence no disaapiontment of expectation of satisfaction from sensual pleasure.
Basudeb Sen
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Date: Tue May 18, 2010 7:13 am

Hari Om,

With due apologies.I do understand that such a question has been deliberately raised to generate discussion, but many human beings do believe so. The truth is that such a perception arises out of ignorance and attachment. On the one hand we are still in darkness not having understood the reality while at the same time we are attached to material things, which tend to provide momentary pleasure and lasting pain. The day we are succeed in sheding our ignorance and understand the reality, we will be free from the pair of opposites; there will be no pleasure, so no pain; no dukhalya no sukhalya. When be become Nirmoh and Nishkam we will experience only bliss.

Hari Om

Shivkumar

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Date: Tue May 18, 2010 3:35 am
Fellow learners


Lord said Samsaara is Duhkhaalayam and Asaasvata. It has sorrow or grief and these are temporary, not permanet. A poet Kulasekhara (2000 yr old) describes :
BHAVAJALADHIGATAANAAM DVAMDVA VAATAA HATAANAAM SUTA DUHITRU KALATRA TRAANA BHAARAARDITAANAAM VISHAMA VISHAYA TOYE MAJJATAAM APLAVAANAAM BHAVATUM EKO VISHNU POTO NARAANAAM.


tHE DUHKHA OF THIS WORLD (SAMSAARA) is not an inherent quality of the world or samsaara. Duhkha is created by us, not by God. God has created atoms and neutrons protons hydrogen uranium etc. But who created atom bomb, nuclear bomb, RDX etc. You attribute it God, then you are foll. Man created this destructive Duhkhaalaya.


If you note this simple truth that World is created by the Lord and whatever Duhkha in it is created by Manava from his Jealousy, Moha, LObha nad of course Kama, then your question Why God created Duhkhaalaya world is irrelevant and meaningless and even frivolous.
krishna

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Date: Tue May 18, 2010 12:39 am

aum

Why is this World, Filled with Sorrow (Dukhaalai) ?

vyasjee's question is pithy........... short and sharp

let the answer , too, be pithy .............. short and piercing ..........

piercing through the obdurate Mind ........... to dwell in the heart !!!

and, the answer is ..............." ask not the world ............ ask yourself !

the world is responsible for its own Misery, ........... and you............. yours !!! "

AUM


PS narinder reads the words of the wise .............. penned in joy in this forum, by the wise and much rejoicing there is , the joy in the heart !

thank you ...........all............ in Love, we become One with the ONE ......
in Joy, we become One with the ONE !!!

AUM

narinder


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Date: Tue May 18, 2010 12:26 am
Dear Sir,
I would beg to differ from this idea. We are here not out of our choice and what ever we are blessed with is and should be considered as Prabhu Prasadam. If we are sent here to experience the world and develop our wisdom than how it can be considered as a Dukhalayam. It can occurr to mind only if we are escaping from this world and reality. Believe me it is a beautiful world and should be seen with positive attitude only and who are we to call his creation as home of sorrows? Just my views.

Hari Om
R.K.Raina
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Date: Mon May 17, 2010 1:09 pm
Dear Ones, Namaste!
Basudebji, I am very satisfied with your answer, have always appreciated them!
This is to respond to Agrasenji's question below about apparent anomaly in Swamiji's Statement!
"There is nothing else but God" means that This Existence before us is Absolute, Undivided, Harmonious, appearing to us as different objects, is exactly what we call God! It is, as though, the Invisible Existence is Visible as Galaxies, Planets, Earth, Mountains, Oceans, forests, Animals, Humans, and anything one can think of! So, we as well as Swamiji and Realized ones see the same world of objects, but there is a difference in dealing with them as they see appearances being disguises God is wearing and hence act for the benefits of all! Their acts come from Truth they have experienced!
How do we know it is One Existence? Before any object is given a name, it already IS, but we fail to notice this IS-ness due to attachment/aversion to such an object! We think it is really a separate object, say, a mountain, or a dog, because we grew up learning them with names and never inquired Reality behind names!
Also as dog, or mountain or any named object, it disappears in time-space but the One Existence or the Isness of such an object continues as other forms, names, attributes etc. The Existence is Immortal, God! It is to be noted that such perishable objects can also be subtle like man-kind's thoughts, beliefs, tendencies, generosity, cruelty, etc as Imprints/Karma on Consciousness/Existence!
Why Swamiji says we need to act with dog as dog and human as human even as they all are God?
Obviously in daily life we act differently towards sisters, mothers, spouses, fathers, brothers, friends, etc..as it is a practical requirements based on their roles. This promotes harmony among various appearances of same God, never forgetting that each appearance is God playing a role! To the extent we disregard this, we act unjustly, and blame God!
Leela is possible only upon Realization that everything we call world is God, the One Existence and therefore subject to our Reverence, and appropriate behavior!
Namaskar..........Pratap Bhatt

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Date: Mon May 17, 2010 12:48 pm
-Shree Hari-

Namaste!

I like the framing by Brother Vyas, ' Why is this World'....... I will try and express my intuitive thoughts on the question.

' The Vision and the Way of Vasistha':
Ch2 374-5: Even so, within every (world) many and divers other (worlds) rise, mutually unseen. All of them do not see each other even a little, like inert matter in the same heap, and like grains dropping down. (from the granary).
379 Since Brahman or the (Ultimate Reality) is existing everywhere, when where and in which manner anything is born, there and in that matter, one perceives it immediately, only by the power (akin to) a dream.

Essence of Yogavaasisistha Ch 8 45: Long Armed One! (Rama!) The state (or condition) of Consciousness, which has gathered or obtained a form due to ignorance (or error) and which is the seat of place, time and action is called the knower of the field, (i.e. the individual soul that experiences the body).

Ever heard of the play of consciousness?

Gitaji 15: 10 The duped do not know the soul having identified itself with the three gunas departing from, or dwelling in the body, or enjoying the objects of senses , but they, who posses the eye of wisdom behold It.

Now to those who feel that one must see things in a rational scientific way see this from Stanislav Grof's "The Cosmic Game":
'..... I have not met a single individual who has had a deep experience of the transcendental realms and continues to subscribe to the world-view of western materialistic science. This development is quite independent of the level of intelligence, type and degree of education, and professionals credentials of the individuals involved.

Finally the words of the Trappist Monk Thomas Merton: 'When we are reduced to our last extreme, there is no further evasion. The choice is a terrible one. It is made in the heart of darkness, but with an intuition that is unbearable in its angelic clarity: when we who have been destroyed and seem to be in hell miraculously choose GOD!'

End of the illusion!

Om... Shanti...

Mike.


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Date: Mon May 17, 2010 11:28 am

Nothing in this world can make you happy. Therein lies the answer to this question. What makes us unhappy? Attatchment to the illusory worldly things cause unhappiness. Anything which is perishibale is an illusion and the product of our imagination. The common attatchments or vasnas are sex, money and power. We can't have enough of these. When our desires are unsatisfied, we become frustrated, angry and sad. Therefore like Buddha and other yogis, we should focous on the real things in life, the things which really matter. What matters is the salvation of our Soul or Self which is the only real thing about us. It is our true identity. It was never born and will never die. It is entirely up to us whether we become a slave of our desires for illusory things which cause us to be born again and again. Or like our Saints we should decide to gain enlightenment through meditation and find out the truth of our existence and attain moksh or liberation in this life itself, with the help of a God realised Guru.
Hari Shanker Deo


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Date: Sun May 16, 2010 10:09 am

Shree Hari

|| Ram Ram ||

Dear Mr. Vyas, thanks for raising the question for the sake of others, am sure you already know the answer.

The world is a 'Dukhalya' only for those who are expecting and hoping to derive Sukh (pleasure) from the world, "Aasha is param dukham" (Hoping for happiness from the world is surely the main source of suffering). Yes, the world can certainly give fleeting pleasures, most seem to be content with it for the time being till they get pain along the way but they still keep searching. They feel O' this time they got fooled, they know better now, it will not happen again. But to their dismay it happens again and again. The individual is unwilling to learn from even the hard blows, his own life experiences are giving hard core messages but the process goes on, the cycle of birth and death continues. They look at others who appear to be happy but when they find out more about them, they too are complaining.

To the disappointment of a common man he is looking for happiness from the world, he fails to get convinced that the world does not have the capability of providing permanent happiness. How can Atma-sukh can be had from Prakriti when the real nature is Chetan (conscious), how can the hungry man get satisfied when someone tying Chapaties on his back.

God did not make the world "Dukhalya", he only provided enough things for all His children to be happy, only condition is when these items are utilized properly used and are not considered one's own. It is people who indulge in Bhoga and Sangrah. Our own Prarabhda provides the situation our mind set determines what we do with it. Man projects his own world according to his mind set (Gitaji 7- 5), The world is neither good or bad, it is up to us what we make of it.

Humble regards,
Madan Kaura
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Date: Sun May 16, 2010 10:14 am
Shree Parmatmane Namah

Respected Friends, Swamiji has said, "Besides that one Paramatma, thee is not else that has ever come into existence!" (Manavmaatre Kalyaan ke liye pg 221). then where has the world come from? What is this world not Paramatma? Now call Paramatma either "Dukhaalaya" (abode of sorrow) or "Sukhaalay" (filled with happiness and joy), it is only Paramatma. Now if yo do not believe, then it is your wish.
Vineet
Sadhak

This entire creation and this life and anything else, whatever you may call it, if it is not Paramatma then what is it? Please tell me. There is great yearning, a deep anguish to know.

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Date: Sun May 16, 2010 10:11 am
Dear Sadhakas,
Hare Krishna.
This is in response to a question from a sadhaka.
If we pursue the three gates to hell , ( Lust, Anger, Greed ), then our lives will be Dukhalayam ,( Bhagavad Gita 16, 21).
But if we spend our lives in devotional service , then our lives will be peaceful and spiritually uplifting.

Lord Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita,
" Samo ham sarva bhuteshu,
Na me dveshyo sti na priyah,
Ye bhajanti tu mam bhaktyam,
Ayi te teshu capy aham. "
( Gitaji 9, 29)
Which means,
' I envy none, nor I am partial to any one. I am equal to all. Who ever renders service unto Me with devotion, is a friend, is in Me and I am also in him. '

Lord Krishna says this material world is Dukhalayam and Asaswatam, (Gitaji 8,15). Materialism leads to misery.

The goal in this life should be, to attain Him. Devotional service takes us there. If we spend our lives in the pursuit of the Lord, then our lives will be full of happiness. Less materialistic we are, happier and peaceful we will be.
Thank You.
Hare Krishna.
Prasad.A.Iragavarapu, M.D

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Date: Sun May 16, 2010 10:15 am
Dear Vyasji, and Sadhakas, Namaste!
With lot of respects for Vyasji, who has served many of us over the years through his insightful postings, I submit the following answer:
Swamiji has already given the answer in first paragraph below which he elaborates in the subsequent ones!
I need not say further, however, it is nice to deliberate this point when invited by Vyasji!
I humbly submit that world is not made Dukhalayam by Paramatma - God, even as it feels like it due to our own ignorance. If it was made sorrowful by God, no one will be free of sorrow, but that is not the case! Saints and Sages and our own Swamiji are examples of being free!
The world in itself is neither Dukhalayam nor Sukhalayam unless we make it so by getting hurt by it!
The root ignorance is to consider this organism of body-mind as my real self, and hence by implications, everything else becomes "not-me" for me. This belief(and its non-verified belief only) leads me to feel lacking within myself being limited, causes desire to arise for fulfillment through objects including people, followed by attachments and aversions to objects and people believing they are separate from me, and we know the rest of the story of Dukhalayam as you point out!
If we were to truly realize by either Gyan, Devotion or Self-less service to so-called others, as pointed out in Gita, that we are, afterall, not such a separate person, but are complete within the way we are, Atman, then we don't lack and therefore, no personal desires, and therefore, no attachment nor aversion to anything and the world becomes playground for us to celebrate with same objects and people, Sukhalayam, or as you often quote "chetan amal sahaj sukh rashi!"
If only I knew to be a bead in the necklace(Mala) of God, losing my individuality as an independent bead and yet remain as bead but move in harmony with other beads in the Mala that Vasudeva IS, I cannot go wrong!
Namaskar..............Pratap Bhatt

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Date: Sun May 16, 2010 10:38 am
Dear Sadaks & Sri Vyasji,
This world is Karma Boomi. Those who have bundles of Vasanas (In form of Sins) have to come here and undergo sorrow (Dukha). As for as animals are concerned they silently, without cursing anyone, without knowing to point out other mistakes even while they are killed, they raise to Human level. But it is pity for humans that pleasures, desires lead them to Vasanas, to put one in cycle of Birth and deaths. But ultimately few, after going through that cycle, get Sat Sang, Bakthi and elevate or liberate. If there is no Dukha, it is Indra Lok. Sastras say one who done ample service, like Daana Dharam, building hospitals, Etc go to Indra Lok. There they spend very long period (1000 of years) of ONLY happiness, and pleasures and nearly after, say 3000 years, they are brought to the cloud level on earth and sent through rain drop which goes to seed level, which in turn as food goes into male to form sperms, which goes to a woman to conceive and that JEEVA again back to same platform of earth- Mother-father-brother-sister- etc. Again Dukha. Earth is for that. Saints realized that and opted to remain in silence abandoning everything. Buddha- Christ- 63 Nayanmars- !2 Alwars- nearly 350 Bakthas. Naradhji for a simple question put to Sri Vishnu, "Why the earth is going away from Bakthi- People are becoming bad". Naradhji was sent to earth for that question as Sant Purander Doss. Sri Mahalakshmi asked Sri Vishnu, "I like that saint Visnuchitar (Later called as Peria Alwar- Head of saints)the way he is making garland with utmost devotion for your idol. SHE was sent to earth as Sri ANDAL who gave the people 30 Slokas of great importance on Sri Krishna called "THRUPAAVAI''. HER story was of recent times and worth knowing. It was during Palava Kings period. HER statue is in many temples of South India. Adi Sankara sang the same what SRI VASJI asked in Vivekachdamani as earth is DUKHA DOSHANA DHARSHANAM. SRI Vyasji please do not look towards earth, look towards Bagavan only. Great Saint Bharatha Yogi in Srimath Bagavath, just a simple and decent desire to rare a deer, YOU know the rest my Pandit. One birth for him as deer and next as Jada Bharat. One advantage on this earth is, anything can attain salvation with help of Sat Sangh. Examples: As a deer (Jada Bharat) was born in Ashram, where he was in constant vibration of Mantras, yagnas, Poojas Etc. This help him to be born with KNOWLEDGE on Sat. An ant, an elephant, a snake, a parrot, a begger went to Vaikunt by Sat Sangh Mahima. Why so much, the plantain trees under which Sant Jaidev sang Srimath Bagavath for few days, went to Vaikunt before him. Allah says (By his hand) nothing is there- empty yourself. Christ says,'' Empty theyself I shall fill in" . Sri Krishna says, "Surrender to me and I shall give you Mukthi" Here surrender meant leave everything to HIM and you become empty. Karn was holding Dharma Puniya in his account. Only on releasing it to Bagavan Sri Krishna he went to abode. From 13 other worlds everyone has to go through this earth to liberation. So make our times most useful.
Namaste
B.Sathyanarayan
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Date: Sun May 16, 2010 11:02 am
Aadarniy Swamiji,

In response to the following question, Swami Ramsukhdaji says that all is VASUDEVA, yet
in paragraph four it states as follows:-

All this does not mean that your behavior has to be the same to all. That is insane, rather it will lead to one's downfall if you treat a dog, the same as a human being. Relating in this world, is dependent on the external situations. Therefore the root of the matter is that, what we see is different depending on how we see the situation. If you are only seeing it outwardly, where you are looking at the perishable, then you will see sorrow. One is inward view, and the other is outward view; one is selfish view and the other is intent of serving.


Please clarify this anomaly in his statement. That means that we have to deal with different people differently according to the circumstances, which is what a common man does! Then how can we also consider a dog Vasudeva while we treat him differently!

agrasen
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Date: Sun May 16, 2010 3:01 pm

The Question is wrong. Paramatma has not created the World or the entire creation as Dukhayam. The entire creation including the World and including Paramatma is completely neutral of Sukham and Dukham. But he has created in human minds desires for Worldly pleasures and satisfaction and he has also created in human hearts and minds sorrows from non-satisfaction of desires. So, the question could as best be why has Paramatma has created the Guna of feeling of sadness or sorrow.?
The answer to this question is answered by another question: what would have happened if the human beings did not have a guna of feeling sorrow? The human beings would not have been human beings. The stars, the sun, the planets, rivers, the waters, the mountains, the coal and gold extracted from mines and the stones do not have the feeling of sorrow. Clearly they do not have pleasures or happiness either. This is because they do not have desire or ego. Thus, if desires, ego, perception of pleasures and pains, happiness and sorrows were not to be in human beings, human beings would not have been created in the first place.
So, the question boils down to why did the Paramatma create human beings? But why deal with this partial question? Why not better ask why did Paramatma create any thing at all - whether human beings or stones or stars? If we have answer to this basic, primary question, that would automatically address the small insignificant question of why he created sorrows? But as per Gita, Paramatma, the creator is nothing but the entire creation and creative and destructive process. Gita says Paramatma is infinite, never born, never died, never created, indestructible and always in extence. So, the Paramtamta, being the Creation itself has always , ceasely existed. It did not have to be created. It has all been there always whether in explicit form or implict. If everything was there implicit in creation, even the feeling of sorrow existed all the time: it became explicit when some elements of the Universe in the continuous transformation process gave rise to some forms called human beings and some feelings in them called sorrow. These are transient phenimenon as is daylight and night or stars which after billions of years disintegrates into infinite pieces or sound waves tranforms in to light waves, So the real question is why is the process of transformation that goes on in the universe creates such things as sorrows and happiness? The answer is simple: to create a transient phenomenon like human beings just as a transient phenonmenon of stars are created. Just as the Sum just happened in the continous transformation process, so did human beings and their feeling of sorrows just happened/ happens. There is no reason to rationalise the appearance of certain transient phenomenon in the transformation process. The only scientific answer would be to relate to certain other phenonmenon that prceded this phenomenon.
There are poets who had ultimately concluded that they want to return to this world birth after birth to experience the beauti of the pleasues and pains , the happiness and the sorrows of human life. How does it matter if many human beings feel that the World is a home for sorrows. There are others who would come to conclusion that the World is a home of beautiful things including sorrows. Some poet said saddest thought are so sweet. So, the answer is : the World is a home for sorrows because it had to be made a home for sweet things as well as so many other things like zealousy, honesty, violence. No one will be satisfied with my long answer. The question actually does not arise: as per Gita sorrows are unreal - they do not exist as do many other things. Yoga is the only but the most difficult method to realize this.
Basudeb Sen
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Shree Hari Ram Ram

PLEASE SEE ONE OF THE POSTINGS FROM SWAMIJI'S DISCOURSES -

Question: On one hand "All is God" (Vasudeva Sarvam) and on the other hand, the "World filled with Sorrow" (Dukhaalai). Which are we to understand ?

Answer: When we desires happiness from the World, then there is nothing but sorrow (dukhaalai). We will get nothing from the World, but sorrow. But when our intention is only to serve the World, then everything is God (Vasudeva Sarvam). When we have no selfish desires, and when the only feeling wihin is to serve others, then we will see only "All is God" (Vasudeva Sarvam).

There is another view. There is an outward perspective and an inner perspective. The inner perspective is only God (Vasudeva), whereas the outer view is the sorrow-filled world (dukhaalai). One who sees the outward form, i.e. beauty etc. is focused on the external view. Whereas one who is looking at the inner view, is seeing equanimity (samtaah) . Just like all gold jewellery appears different in shape and form, however inwardly, it is only gold. Similarly seeing towards the inner sentiments, looking at everything from it's very essence, one sees only God. Equanimity is God. When mind is established in equanimity, one gains victory over the world. "Panditaah samdarshinah."

Most people see the outward, but those who see the essence, see equanimity (samdarshinah), where everything is seen as God's Essence. Out attention is on the world, and therefore we see the world and it's sorrows, but from inside it is consciousness. One who sees the essence, sees the essence of God in all.

All this does not mean that your behavior has to be the same to all. That is insane, rather it will lead to one's downfall if you treat a dog, the same as a human being. Relating in this world, is dependent on the external situations. Therefore the root of the matter is that, what we see is different depending on how we see the situation. If you are only seeing it outwardly, where you are looking at the perishable, then you will see sorrow. One is inward view, and the other is outward view; one is selfish view and the other is intent of serving.

In reality, there is only one essence, essential element (tattva). That essence is only God "Vasudeva". The outward is false and unreal, as it is perishable. Those who pay attention to the perishable, see the world as filled with sorrow (dukhaalai). Whereas, those who see the Essence, see the essence of God. (to be continued)

From Discources in Hindi on February 13th, 1991 at 5:00 am by Swami Ramsukhdasji

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